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Character A gives a target the dazed condition until the end of character A's next turn, but character A dies before their next turn.

What happens to the dazed condition? When does it last until now?

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Not being a 4e expert and not having my book handy, I'll hazard a guess and say it lasts until the turn would have ended. –  Kyle Willey Mar 3 at 1:02
@BlackEye NPCs are characters - that's what the C stands for. Since this applies to both PCs and NPCs equally, it can be left at just characters, in case there are rule specifics between monsters and PCs. –  Jonathan Hobbs Mar 13 at 22:14

5 Answers 5

Generally, conditions and effects stay, however, specific conditions will go away.

Dazed has no such exception and stays until it has run its course. If the attacker is dead and the condition is End of Next Turn, then it stays until the attacker's turn in the initiative order comes up.

From Conditions:

Duration: The effect that imposes a condition on a creature specifies how long the condition lasts. For instance, a cleric might use an attack power that makes its target blinded (save ends). However, some conditions have built-in rules for when they end. For instance, the prone condition ends on a character who stands up, and the dying condition ends on a character who regains hit points.

Things that go away when you're dead:

  • Conjurations
  • Marks
  • Grabs
  • Auras
  • Stances
  • Zones

Things that work differently when the caster is dead:

  • Dominated

Things that work normally when the caster is dead:

  • Everything else. (dazed, stunned, slowed, immobilized)

Conjurations and Zones explicitly say that they disappear when their caster dies:

Conjuration... Death Ends: A conjuration ends immediately if its creator dies.

Marked... A mark ends immediately when its creator dies or falls unconscious.

Grab...if you are affected by a condition that prevents you from taking opportunity actions (such as dazed, stunned, surprised, or unconscious), you immediately let go of a grabbed enemy.

Auras...Death or Unconsciousness Ends: A creature’s auras end immediately when it falls unconscious or dies.

Stance...A stance lasts until the character assumes another stance or until the character falls unconscious or dies

Zone... Death Ends: A zone ends immediately if its creator dies.

Anything that isn't a conjuration, a mark, a grab or an Aura does not end when the creature dies. However, specific conditions do require the user to be conscious to execute. For instance Dominated reads:

Dominated...The creature can’t take actions voluntarily. Instead, the dominator chooses a single action for the creature to take on the creature’s turn: a standard, a move, a minor, or a free action. The only powers and other game features that the dominator can make the creature use are ones that can be used at will, such as at-will powers. For example, anything that is limited to being used only once per encounter or once per day does not qualify.

Clearly the dominator must be conscious for this to have effect. However, the dominated would still be unable to take actions on their own.

However, these are the only (as far as I can find) conditions that end or change on unconsciousness or death. All other conditions remain until their durations end.

(All quotes are from the RC, I an add page numbers on request).

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don't status effects other than those that deal damage end as well? –  Joshua Aslan Smith Mar 3 at 19:49
@JoshuaAslanSmith you mean like when the affected character dies? –  wax eagle Mar 3 at 20:19
yes, but also when they go unconscious. –  Joshua Aslan Smith Mar 3 at 20:22

Your question is based on a misunderstanding.

Character A hasn't ceased to exist, they've simply gained the condition "dead". You can tell because the wording is the same as when a condition is applied, "character C is unconscious, character D is stunned, character E is dead".

Admittedly the "dead" condition isn't actually explained anywhere, and to my understanding this has never been errated, however I don't believe it says anywhere their initiative changes, or is somehow "removed" from the order, I'm not sure where you get that idea. If it does say that, you probably should have put it in your question.

In general, a character who is dead is also unconscious, which prevents actions, so people often skip them in the turn order, but this is not a rule. If they are dead and somehow still conscious, presumably they still get actions, but this doesn't change when conditions go away.

So Character A's turn still happens, and at the end of it the condition goes away, unless the power or the power's keywords specifically state it goes away earlier, such as on unconsciousness or death.

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Very good point, typically if, say, they get turned into a wraith when they die, they'll keep their same init. –  wax eagle Mar 13 at 11:48
I corrected the question from 'character' to 'npc'". Do NPCs also have a 'dead' condition? –  BlackEye Mar 13 at 19:31
@BlackEye technically, yes. There are plenty of monsters that raise an NPC or even NPCs who get raised automatically. The only real question might be what happens for that rare NPC who changes initiative position when they are raised (though that's a separate question). –  wax eagle Mar 13 at 19:49

The rules on Zone powers explicitly state that the Zone ends when the caster dies. As other durations have no such explicit rule, I would recommend you leave the condition in place until it would have normally ended.

It should be obvious, but I'll mention it anyway: if the effect requires the caster use an action to sustain it, the effect is going to go away (when that character's turn would normally be, going by the above, unless it's a zone being sustained), as the caster can no longer take the required sustain action.

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@waxeagle, "If a zone's creator is slain, the zone immediately ends." PHB p59 (Conjuration has the exact same wording on the same page) –  Brian S Mar 3 at 16:00
Thanks, for some reason that text didn't make it into the online compendium. RC 121 has it as well. –  wax eagle Mar 3 at 16:15

Short version: There is no actual hard answer on that question.


Okay lets say player didn't die instantly. He's just at 0 hp's and trying to stabilize via saving throws. In that case his powers still take place. Since rules says:

Dying: When and adventurer's hit points drop to 0 or fewer, he or she falls unconscious and is dying

He cant take new actions and with unconscious condition which means he's helpless(grants advantage), can't take actions, -5 to all defences etc. Since he can't take actions, he can't sustain some powers, but nothing says about powers being negated. So in that case all 'until the end of your next turn' and 'until the end of encounter' powers are still in place.

But if player was killed instantly

Death: When an adventurer takes damage that reduces his or her current hit points to his or her bloodied value expressed as a negative number, the adventurer dies.

Thats all that says in rules. The rest is house ruled most of the times.

In my group we're trying determine effect and think if it's logical to continue. Warlord's inspirations can't work without living warlord. But somekind of bleeding effect can continue without creature that caused it.

Although between wizard's community there is an idea that all powers that don't need to be sustaned(via minor action) are lasts as intended. Even if source dies. Magic. 4 ED is full of illogical things and rules that are officialy confurmed by WOtC. I will not be surprised if this is the same case.

That's all I can say about this situation.

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You seem to be quoting 3.5 rules for a 4e question. Players don't die at -10, they die when they fail their death saving throw three times or hit -(bloodied). With a few exceptions, NPCs die (or are knocked unconscious, attacker's choice IIRC) when they hit 0. Your quote on the Helpless condition refers to 3.5 terms such as full-round action, and you talk about abilities being lowered (I know of no ability-damaging/reducing effect in 4e). –  Brian S Mar 3 at 13:41
Omg, you're right. Wrong compendium. I'll edit my post asap –  UtherTG Mar 3 at 14:16
Should probably mention some specific conditions that do specify they end when the inflicter dies, like marked. –  wax eagle Mar 3 at 14:35

I would use common sense and say in general it would last until the end of Player's A next turn would occur. The only time I would think it would end earlier is if Player A needed to maintain some type of concentration (e.g., spell or feat) to maintain the effect. If the dazed condition was due to injury or stun effect, it wouldn't be affected by Player A's condition.

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I didn't down vote you, but I'm not up voting either. While I think you're correct, there should be a definitive answer to this in the rules. There should be either a rule explicitly describing what happens to effects when their originator dies, or a counter example where an effect explicitly does or does not end when the originator dies (implying that normally the opposite would happen). 4e is heavily based on "what the rules say" rather than common sense; it jettisons simulationism to preserve balance (and reduce corner cases and GM fiat). –  Oblivious Sage Mar 3 at 3:56

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