Take the 2-minute tour ×
Role-playing Games Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for gamemasters and players of tabletop, paper-and-pencil role-playing games. It's 100% free, no registration required.

I think I just discovered a combo for a cleric, but I'm not sure if it actually works.

Weapon of the Gods (PHB) is a daily which allows you to do an extra 1d6 radiant when you make an attack with your weapon (in this case a longbow) until the end of the encounter.

Seldarine Dedicate (DP) is a Paragon Path with a feature which allows you to use your bow as an Implement for using your powers.

If you have both, would using Weapon of the Gods mean all of your implement attacks gain the bonus for the rest of the encounter? You are using your bow as an implement to use the powers, after all.

Conclusion: Thank you for your answers. In particular, thank you to Soulrift for providing me with the post-errata description of "Weapon of the Gods" and DCShannon for a detailed examination of the powers as originally written.

My group and I are unable to view the source material containing the post-errata description of "Weapon of the Gods" so cannot verify Soulrift's information. However, given what DCShannon said, it is clear that this description has always been RAI. The original description was simply badly worded which resulted in the RAW allowing for this combo. I may discuss this with my DM although it looks like the best option for balance etc. would be to use Soulrift's post-errata description.

share|improve this question

3 Answers 3

up vote 1 down vote accepted
+100

It seems that Wizards has published errata for the power in question, Weapon of the Gods, but it is only visible for DDI subscribers. The official errata published for non-subscribers does not include these changes, as can be seen in the relevant PDFs: Player's Handbook Errata PDF, Divine Power Errata PDF.

My playgroup has no DDI subscribers in it, so it only makes sense for us to ignore these sort of changes. Therefore, this question will have two answers, depending on if you care about DDI or not:

With DDI, No

Weapon of the Gods' Effect line says

Until the end of the encounter, the target deals 1d6 extra radiant damage when used to make a weapon attack. In addition, whenever an enemy is hit by a weapon attack using the target, that enemy takes a -2 penalty to AC until the end of the next turn of the target’s wielder.

The key phrase here is "Weapon attack". The only attacks which are "Weapon attacks" are ones with the 'Weapon' keyword.

Seldarine Dedicate's Honor the Bow feature says

You can use a longbow or shortbow as an implement for your cleric or Seldarine dedicate implement powers. When you use an implement power through a longbow or a shortbow, you add the weapon's enhancement bonus, if any, to the power's attack rolls and damage rolls, but you don't use the weapon's proficiency bonus. If you score a critical hit with a magic longbow or shortbow when using it as an implement, you use the weapon's critical hit effect.

This feature allows you to use a bow, which is a weapon, as an implement. It does not add the Weapon keyword to attacks made with a bow. Therefore, since these attacks are still not Weapon attacks, Weapon of the Gods would not trigger, even though you are using a weapon to make the attacks.

Without DDI, Yes

The phrasing of Honor the Bow remains the same, but Weapon of the Gods originally read:

Until the end of the encounter, all attacks made with the weapon deal an extra 1d6 radiant damage. When the weapon hits an enemy, the enemy takes a -2 penalty to AC until the end of the weapon wielder's next turn.

Note that this phrasing does not say "Weapon attacks", but instead "attacks made with the weapon". So, even though your Implement attacks haven't gained the Weapon keyword, you are using a bow, which is a weapon, to make the attack. Therefore, any Implement attacks made with the bow after targeting it with Weapon of the Gods are "attacks made with the weapon" and you would get the extra benefits.

Role-Playing

If you're not overly concerned with the technical RAW interpretation of things, you might be more interested in what makes sense in your game world and what is implied by the text descriptions of the game elements you're looking at. You could go several ways with this, depending on what ruling you go with concerning the legitimacy of the combo.

For an in-game explanation consistent with this combo not working, look at Weapon of the Gods' flavor text: "Your weapon glows with divine radiance, enhancing your attacks", and notice that it has on on-hit effect: "when the weapon hits an enemy...". So, basically your sword is glowing and does extra damage when it hits. Since this is a ranged weapon we're talking about, it would be the arrows that get radiant. You don't fire any arrows for those implement attacks, so it makes sense that nothing extra would happen.

On the other hand, maybe the bow is glowing and it imparts radiant power to each arrow as it's loosed. In this case, if holy powers are channeled through the bow, then it makes sense they might be even more holy, even if no arrows are involved.

On the third hand (this is fantasy after all), the text description of the Seldarine Dedicate says "Your weapon is inscribed with sigils and runes, which flare with emerald light when you fire a shot with a whispered prayer". To me, this implies you're supposed to be shooting the bow in a holy fashion, which would imply that instead of just saying a prayer with a holy symbol for your powers, you now shoot holy arrows at things. Furthermore, your lvl 20 Daily says "you launch a fiery bolt from your bow that erupts into white-hot flame where it hits", but is an implement power without the Weapon keyword. So you could instead view all your implement attacks as bow attacks which actually involve shooting an arrow or arrows.

So, if it were me, I would ask my DM to allow this combo to work, if only because I think the second and third explanations make more sense than the first. But be up-front about the fact that it is not technically RAW with DDI, and that therefore there could possibly be balance issues.

Whatever rules you decide to go with, the role-playing flavor is ultimately up to you, so choose something consistent with those rules.

share|improve this answer

No

The text for Weapon of the Gods was corrected in errata on (4/25/2011) to make the wording consistent with the Compendium and clarify this issue. The power now reads:

Weapon of the Gods Cleric Attack 5
The weapon you touch glows with divine radiance, enhancing its attacks.
Daily ✦ Divine
Minor Action ✦ Melee touch

Target: One held weapon

Effect: Until the end of the encounter, the target deals 1d6 extra radiant damage when used to make a weapon attack. In addition, whenever an enemy is hit by a weapon attack using the target, that enemy takes a -2 penalty to AC until the end of the next turn of the target’s wielder.

(emphasis added)

DDI link: http://www.wizards.com/dndinsider/compendium/power.aspx?id=1406

Thus, the weapon must be used with a weapon attack in order to benefit from this power.

share|improve this answer
    
Indeed; Weapon of the Gods wasn't in the PHB errata, though according to the question it was from the PHB. –  doppelgreener Jun 10 at 1:18
    
I took it from the DDI online Compendium (subscription required), which says the errata was made to make the power consistent with the "Class Compendium" source, which was later removed from publication. The errata were then published in Dragon magazine. dnd4.wikia.com/wiki/Class_Compendium –  Soulrift Jun 10 at 12:55
    
What issue of dragon magazine was this printed in? I don't have a subscription so I can't check the compendium but my friend says he can find it in the magazine if he knows the issue number. –  user14621 Jun 10 at 16:33

Weapon of the Gods give the extra damage when the longbow you cast is on is "used to make a weapon attack". Powers that don't have the weapon keyword, but have the implement keyword instead do not count as weapon attacks.

share|improve this answer
    
I see. I wasn't sure because it doesn't say it's for "weapon attacks" only. Instead it says "all attacks made with the weapon". The wording made it seem like it would work. So the 1d6 radiant only applies to powers which use the weapon keyword then? –  user14621 Jun 9 at 17:52
1  
It would help to quote the exact text of both in your question, in a quote box. –  doppelgreener Jun 9 at 22:23
    
My quotation was from the player's handbook... –  user14621 Jun 10 at 15:32

Your Answer

 
discard

By posting your answer, you agree to the privacy policy and terms of service.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.