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The L7 fighter Power Come and Get It specifies that you can pull enemies in a burst 3 up to 2 squares, but mandates that they become adjacent to you.

How does this interact with creatures that can reduce forced movement such as Dwarves. Does it prevent the pull or does it limit it to fewer squares?

Edit to include question expansion:

If the dwarf is one square away and has a forced movement reduction of 1 and the power specifies I can pull 2. Does the dwarf end up adjacent to me?

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3 Answers 3

up vote 8 down vote accepted

This is apparently an oldie, but a recent comment by Wax Eagle brought me here. How about a revival?

Here's how I read it:

Dwarf

Stand Your Ground: When an effect forces you to move — through a pull, a push, or a slide — you can move 1 square less than the effect specifies. This means an effect that normally pulls, pushes, or slides a target 1 square does not force you to move unless you want to.

Rules Compendium, pg 212:

When a distance is specified, it is a maximum; the creature or effect producing the forced movement can move its target up to that number of squares (or none at all). For instance, a character's power might say, "You slide the target 4 squares (or "up to 4 squares"); both mean the character can move the target up to 4 squares or not move it at all. When a destination is specified, it is absolute; the creature or effect must either move the target to that destination or not move it at all.

WRT a Dwarf 1 square away: "Stand Your Ground" ability states that, "You can move 1 square less than the effect specifies". Also, "pull 2" allows me to move the the target up to 2 squares. Moving the dwarf 1 square is both "up to 2 squares" and also "1 less than the power specifies".

What I think is key here is that nowhere do I find that it requires that the "forced mover" specify the number of squares they will move the target at the time of moving them. Rather, the rules clearly state it's a maximum distance that may be moved in whole or in part. The mover simply declares they pull the Dwarf 2 squares and proceed to move it only 1, with or without the Dwarf's objection to the extra square of movement remaining.

WRT a Dwarf 2 squares away:

From Come and Get It

Hit: You pull the target up to 2 squares, but only if it can end the pull adjacent to you. If the target is adjacent to you after the pull, it takes 1[W] damage.

The destination is specified, "adjacent to you". The effect either moves the target to the destination, or does not move it at all. Given that the Dwarf 2 squares away can prevent the target destination from being reached, it therefore prevents the movement from happening at all. IMO, for this scenario the power would have been better served to have read, "You pull the target 2 squares to a square adjacent to you. Targets moved adjacent to you in this manner take 1[W] damage."

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I've been looking for a better answer to this question for some time. I think you've nailed it. –  wax eagle Apr 11 '12 at 16:54
    
Well articulated - I think this is what my answer was trying to drive at. –  Simon Withers Apr 11 '12 at 21:22
    
This is definitely the RAW interpretation...but if I were DMing it I would apply Rule 0 and pick something else-- I doubt this was the original intent. –  Snowbody Apr 13 '12 at 22:04
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Any forced movement reduction is applied normally.

Come and Get it power description

Note that the text says "if it can end the pull adjacent to you". It doesn't have to actually end there, it just needs to be able to end there. The power also says "if the target is adjacent to you after the pull", implying that it may not actually end there.

EDIT: Regarding your edit, I can see merit in the argument that the player needs to declare they are pulling 1 instead of 2, since that's all they can do, and then the dwarf applies his reduction, stopping the movement altogether.

However, that's not the way I see it. I would say that yes, the dwarf ends up next to you. I imagine a pull 2 of having a force of 2. The dwarf can reduce it, but it's not enough to resist the pull completely. Unfortunately I don't have a rule to cite for this, it's just my opinion.

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how about the corollary, a creature with reduce 1 is 1 square away, does pull 2 get him in? I assume it does. Also, is that the current version of that power? If so I need to print a new character sheet...my version pulls as an effect... –  wax eagle Jul 6 '11 at 13:54
    
Hmmm that's a good question. Do you declare a pull of 1 and it's reduced by 1, meaning it doesn't move? Or can you react to the reaction and pull the extra square? I don't have an answer to that one. And yes, this is what the compendium has. It's been like that for at least a month or so (that's when I last printed my fighter's sheet and he has this power, and it's listed as a Hit). –  dpatchery Jul 6 '11 at 14:03
    
yeah I'm still hung up on the format of the old offline CB's sheet, I guess its time to migrate fully to the online one. As far as the pull let me clarify my question to include my comment above as its a major part of the question –  wax eagle Jul 6 '11 at 14:05
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My interpretation -

Come and Get It gives a "forced movement move speed" of 2. Stand Your Ground reduces the "forced movement move speed" by 1. Then you move the target.


It would seem to me, that the crux of the question boils down to:

When I "pull the target up to 2 squares", and it can opt to resist one square of pull, and I want it to move one square into an adjacent square, which of these can happen:

1) Declare that I'm pulling it one square into the adjacent square, at which point it chooses to Stand Your Ground and that's the end.

or

2) Declare that I'm pulling it up to two squares into the adjacent square, at which point it chooses to Stand Your Ground at which point I move it the one square.

or

3) Declare that I'm pulling it two squares into the adjacent square, which doesn't make sense as the only legal pull into the adjacent square is a one square pull.

and what happens if we're not talking about Stand Your Ground but a limited use reaction?

Is there a 4) Declare that I'm pulling it one square into the adjacent square, at which point it chooses to resist, at which point I declared that I'll pull it a second square at which point I move it the one square?

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#2 makes the most sense to me. Just wondering if there was a clear rule one way or the other. –  wax eagle Jul 7 '11 at 2:01
    
Unfortunately, I don't have a rules citation :( –  Simon Withers Jul 8 '11 at 0:49
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