Timeline for Do spells cast using the Cleric's ACF Spontaneous Domain Casting qualify as casting a domain spell?
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| Sep 14, 2021 at 1:02 | history | edited | Wannabe Warlock | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
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| Sep 11, 2021 at 21:46 | comment | added | KRyan | @WannabeWarlock See my answer, where I have taken advantage of the greater space to explain in more detail. In short, there are two separate meanings of the phrase “domain spell,” and you’re mixing them up. Your conclusion is probably sound—at least contextually, as likely intended by the authors—but your analysis for determining that conclusion is flawed. | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 21:39 | comment | added | Wannabe Warlock | @KRyan is there something I missing where a domain spell is defined differently than what I say my answer? Because something cannot be used as a domain spell unless a method for such is provided in the rules. As you sometimes point out in answers, one of the reasons people can't use something is because the rules have not allowed for it, and one can't do anything that the rules do not allow for. | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 20:35 | comment | added | KRyan | Also, “A spell cannot be a domain spell unless it is prepared into a domain spell slot,” does not follow from the quote that this is supposed to be an analysis of. The quoted text actually states the converse of that—that a spell must be a domain spell in order to go into that slot, not (necessarily) that it must go into that slot in order to be a domain spell. (Actually, even saying that much requires reading the word “domain” in between the lines where the quote just says “a spell.”) This is a converse fallacy. | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 20:30 | comment | added | KRyan | Ah, I see some of the confusion: some of the rules refer to the prepared spell in the domain slot as a “domain spell,” eliding the “prepared.” Unfortunately very common. However, since literally the very next thing you quote also uses “domain spell” to refer to the spells you could prepare from each domain, you need to justify the implicit claim that empowered healing means the former and not the latter—particularly since the latter is your “primary” quote up front, which it simply shouldn’t be. I can sort of see an argument for your case here based on “cast” in RSoP, but it’s tricky. | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 20:15 | comment | added | Wannabe Warlock | @PlayPatrice it does not say that you spontaneously cast a domain spell from one of your domains, though. It says you spontaneously cast a spell from one of your domains. Just like cure light wounds is a spell in the healing domain domain spells. It's like a Venn diagram of spells and domain spells | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 19:59 | comment | added | Play Patrice | "You can convert stored spell energy into the spells of one of your domains." - With the ACF our cure spells are being spontaneously cast as a Domain Spell. Spell of our domain = domain spell? Were no longer spontaneously casting a cure spell, but spontaneously casting a Healing Domain spell... Or at least that's the crux of the argument to allow for spontaneous empowered / maximized. But your argument is that domain spells only come from the domain slots. Correct? | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 19:50 | history | edited | Wannabe Warlock | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
even more clarification
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| Sep 11, 2021 at 19:39 | comment | added | Wannabe Warlock | @annoyingimp I updated the answer to include additional info. | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 19:38 | history | edited | Wannabe Warlock | CC BY-SA 4.0 |
domain spell info
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| Sep 11, 2021 at 19:33 | comment | added | KRyan | That is demonstrably false. A cleric typically gets two domain spells per spell level, though any number 0–3 is possible—it just matches the number of domains they have. Each domain gives one per spell level. And no per day involved; you don’t expend domain spells, just the slot to prepare them in and cast them from. Of at least so say the quotes you have included in this answer. | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 19:24 | comment | added | Wannabe Warlock | @kryan no. The domain spell slot is the spell slot allocated to the domain spell. A cleric gets one domain spell per spell level per day which fills the domain spell slot. The domain spell is a defined thing here. | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 19:11 | comment | added | Play Patrice | I am watching this "Thread" and can see the arguments to both sides (which is why I asked the question). I do appreciate the dialogue going on here. <3 | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 13:03 | comment | added | KRyan | What this answer needs is something saying something like “you can only prepare a domain spell in a domain slot,” which would make it clearer that even if you have the same spell on your list and prepare it in other slots, those don’t count as the domain spell. That would still require some effort to determine whether or not spontaneous domain casting would be an exception, though... | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 13:00 | comment | added | KRyan | This answer incorrectly conflates “domain spell” and “domain slot.” In particular, the very first quote describing a “domain spell” describe it as something you get from each domain—that is, with two domains, you get two domain spells per spell level—but clerics only get one domain slot of each spell level, and have to pick which of the two (usually) domain spells they have for that level are going in the one slot that day. Since the rest of the answer follows from the idea that “domain spell” refers to the “domain slot,” none of it is supported. | |
| Sep 11, 2021 at 7:33 | comment | added | annoying imp | OK, I agree there is an inconsistency in the rules on this subject. While I still disagree, there is no way to clearly back up one or another point of view without speculation. I'll remove -1 on opportunity, right now it is locked. | |
| Sep 10, 2021 at 21:49 | comment | added | Wannabe Warlock | @annoyingimp another way to look at it: a domain spell cannot be chosen for spontaneous casting: The cleric can "lose" any prepared spell that is not a domain spell in order to cast... This makes it clear, otherwise no cleric could substitute a cure/inflict spell for any spell from their domain spell list | |
| Sep 10, 2021 at 21:44 | comment | added | Wannabe Warlock | @annoyingimp no. That line is merely pointing out that the presence of a spell as a domain spell does not restrict a cleric from only memorizing it as a domain spell rather than an ordinary spell. I.e. cure light wounds can be memorized in normal spell slots even if it is also the level 1 domain spell. It doesn't change that there is only one domain spell per spell level. | |
| Sep 10, 2021 at 21:10 | comment | added | annoying imp | 'If a domain spell is on the cleric spell list, a cleric can prepare it in any of his spell slots.' is the reversed case of what I quoted first. It clearly says, domain spell, even if prepared in non-domain spell slot, is still a domain spell, doesn't it? | |
| Sep 10, 2021 at 20:56 | comment | added | Wannabe Warlock | @annoyingimp specific vs general. The feat grants the capability to prepare spells from the domain spell list. It does not grant additional domain spells which have a specific definition. | |
| Sep 10, 2021 at 20:23 | comment | added | annoying imp | -1: The passage you quoted continues with: "If a domain spell is not on the cleric spell list, a cleric can prepare it only in his domain spell slot." So, it is still a domain spell, even if it isn't prepared in domain spell slot. | |
| Sep 10, 2021 at 19:58 | history | answered | Wannabe Warlock | CC BY-SA 4.0 |