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You know, like how the Mouth of Sauron is just a mouthpiece and nothing more. Even his name was forgotten.

Mouth of Sauron as analogy for lore master being the mouth of the GM...

Many a time, I have see this type of exchange withwhen dealing with a lore master character archetype, in a game style that places control over the facts of the world with the GM, and not with the players.

The GM describes something the players are not familiar with in the game world. For example, this can be a new Japanese corporation in Cyberpunk, a scroll written in a non-roman alphabet, or a reference to some as-yet unfamiliar past event. Let this be the mystery.

One of the character has a knowledge based skill that would fit perfectly to determine whether or not said characters knows something about the mystery alludedestablished above. In fact, it is more than that: the player wanted to play a lore-master archetype, in other words someone who knows those things. Maybe they are gridlinked, maybe they have spend all their livelife inside a library, maybe they just read the right set of eldritch books. Whatever, the situation is that the character should know that information but the player does not.

Back to the mystery. Whether or not the dice roll to pass the skill test was successful or not+, the GM is left with either:

(i) Tell all the players a the same time, speaking in the voice of the character. Thus making the lore master character a glorified NPC a la Mouth Of Sauron.

(ii) Take the lore master out of the room, tell them the information. Then correct things they have either missed, or misremembered, or got confused when they tell the rest of the players. This is tedious and takes way too much time.

(iii) Be omniscient and have given said lore master player all the information they need at the start of the game/session. (Yeah, right.)

  1. Tell all the players a the same time, speaking in the voice of the character. Thus making the lore master character a glorified NPC a la Mouth Of Sauron.

  2. Take the lore master out of the room, tell them the information. Then correct things they have either missed, or misremembered, or got confused when they tell the rest of the players. This is tedious and takes way too much time.

  3. Be omniscient and have given said lore master player all the information they need at the start of the game/session. (Yeah, right.)

None of those solutions appeal to me for the reasons given.


+: The way I handle the situation is that the player always gets some true information but the amount of false information increases based on the degree of failure of the roll. Never is there a point where no true information is ever passed. Edge cases are not covered here...

You know, like the Mouth of Sauron is just a mouthpiece and nothing more. Even his name was forgotten.

Mouth of Sauron as analogy for lore master being the mouth of the GM...

Many a time, I have see this type of exchange with dealing with a lore master character archetype, in a game style that places control over the facts of the world with the GM, and not with the players.

The GM describes something the players are not familiar with in the game world. For example, this can be a new Japanese corporation in Cyberpunk, a scroll written in a non-roman alphabet, or a reference to some as-yet unfamiliar past event. Let this be the mystery.

One of the character has a knowledge based skill that would fit perfectly to determine whether or not said characters knows something about the mystery alluded above. In fact, it is more than that: the player wanted to play a lore-master archetype, in other words someone who knows those things. Maybe they are gridlinked, maybe they have spend all their live inside a library, maybe they just read the right set of eldritch books. Whatever, the situation is that the character should know that information but the player does not.

Back to the mystery. Whether or not the dice roll to pass the skill test was successful or not+, the GM is left with either:

(i) Tell all the players a the same time, speaking in the voice of the character. Thus making the lore master character a glorified NPC a la Mouth Of Sauron.

(ii) Take the lore master out of the room, tell them the information. Then correct things they have either missed, or misremembered, or got confused when they tell the rest of the players. This is tedious and takes way too much time.

(iii) Be omniscient and have given said lore master player all the information they need at the start of the game/session. (Yeah, right.)

None of those solutions appeal to me for the reasons given.


+: The way I handle the situation is that the player always gets some true information but the amount of false information increases based on the degree of failure of the roll. Never is there a point where no true information is ever passed. Edge cases are not covered here...

You know, like how the Mouth of Sauron is just a mouthpiece and nothing more. Even his name was forgotten.

Mouth of Sauron as analogy for lore master being the mouth of the GM...

Many a time, I have see this type of exchange when dealing with a lore master character archetype, in a game style that places control over the facts of the world with the GM, and not with the players.

The GM describes something the players are not familiar with in the game world. For example, this can be a new Japanese corporation in Cyberpunk, a scroll written in a non-roman alphabet, or a reference to some as-yet unfamiliar past event. Let this be the mystery.

One of the character has a knowledge based skill that would fit perfectly to determine whether or not said characters knows something about the mystery established above. In fact, it is more than that: the player wanted to play a lore-master archetype, in other words someone who knows those things. Maybe they are gridlinked, maybe they have spend all their life inside a library, maybe they just read the right set of eldritch books. Whatever, the situation is that the character should know that information but the player does not.

Back to the mystery. Whether or not the dice roll to pass the skill test was successful or not, the GM is left with either:

  1. Tell all the players a the same time, speaking in the voice of the character. Thus making the lore master character a glorified NPC a la Mouth Of Sauron.

  2. Take the lore master out of the room, tell them the information. Then correct things they have either missed, or misremembered, or got confused when they tell the rest of the players. This is tedious and takes way too much time.

  3. Be omniscient and have given said lore master player all the information they need at the start of the game/session. (Yeah, right.)

None of those solutions appeal to me for the reasons given.


The way I handle the situation is that the player always gets some true information but the amount of false information increases based on the degree of failure of the roll. Never is there a point where no true information is ever passed. Edge cases are not covered here...

4 deleted 104 characters in body; edited tags; edited title
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Enhance the role of the lore master character archetype when the How do you make loremaster characters more than just a GM controls the factsmouthpiece?

You know, like the Mouth of Sauron is just a mouthpiece and nothing more. Even his name was forgotten.

Mouth of Sauron as analogy for lore master being the mouth of the GM...

Many a time, I have see this type of exchange with dealing with a lore master character archetype, in a game style that places control over the facts of the world with the GM, and not with the players.

The GM describes something the players are not familiar with in the game world. For example, this can be a new Japanese corporation in Cyberpunk, a scroll written in a non-roman alphabet, or a reference to some as-yet unfamiliar past event. Let this be the mystery.

One of the character has a knowledge based skill that would fit perfectly to determine whether or not said characters knows something about the mystery alluded above. In fact, it is more than that: the player wanted to play a lore-master archetype, in other words someone who knows those things. Maybe they are gridlinked, maybe they have spend all their live inside a library, maybe they just read the right set of eldritch books. Whatever, the situation is that the character should know that information but the player does not.

Back to the mystery. Whether or not the dice roll to pass the skill test was successful or not+, the GM is left with either:   

(i) Tell all the players a the same time, speaking in the voice of the character. Thus making the lore master character a glorified NPC a la Mouth Of Sauron.   

(ii) Take the lore master out of the room, tell them the information. Then correct things they have either missed, or misremembered, or got confused when they tell the rest of the players. This is tedious and takes way too much time.   

(iii) Be omniscient and have given said lore master player all the information they need at the start of the game/session. Yeah(Yeah, right⸮right.)

None of those solutions appeal to me for the reasons given. Thus:

(TL;RD) How to stop lore master archetype characters becoming just the mouth of the GM?

You know, like the Mouth of Sauron is just a mouth piece and nothing more. Even his name was forgotten.

Mouth of Sauron as analogy for lore master being the mouth of the GM...


+: The way I handle the situation is that the player always gets some true information but the amount of false information increases based on the degree of failure of the roll. Never is there a point where no true information is ever passed. Edge cases are not covered here...

Enhance the role of the lore master character archetype when the GM controls the facts

Many a time, I have see this type of exchange with dealing with a lore master character archetype, in a game style that places control over the facts of the world with the GM, and not with the players.

The GM describes something the players are not familiar with in the game world. For example, this can be a new Japanese corporation in Cyberpunk, a scroll written in a non-roman alphabet, or a reference to some as-yet unfamiliar past event. Let this be the mystery.

One of the character has a knowledge based skill that would fit perfectly to determine whether or not said characters knows something about the mystery alluded above. In fact, it is more than that: the player wanted to play a lore-master archetype, in other words someone who knows those things. Maybe they are gridlinked, maybe they have spend all their live inside a library, maybe they just read the right set of eldritch books. Whatever, the situation is that the character should know that information but the player does not.

Back to the mystery. Whether or not the dice roll to pass the skill test was successful or not+, the GM is left with either:  (i) Tell all the players a the same time, speaking in the voice of the character. Thus making the lore master character a glorified NPC a la Mouth Of Sauron.  (ii) Take the lore master out of the room, tell them the information. Then correct things they have either missed, or misremembered, or got confused when they tell the rest of the players. This is tedious and takes way too much time.  (iii) Be omniscient and have given said lore master player all the information they need at the start of the game/session. Yeah, right⸮

None of those solutions appeal to me for the reasons given. Thus:

(TL;RD) How to stop lore master archetype characters becoming just the mouth of the GM?

You know, like the Mouth of Sauron is just a mouth piece and nothing more. Even his name was forgotten.

Mouth of Sauron as analogy for lore master being the mouth of the GM...


+: The way I handle the situation is that the player always gets some true information but the amount of false information increases based on the degree of failure of the roll. Never is there a point where no true information is ever passed. Edge cases are not covered here...

How do you make loremaster characters more than just a GM mouthpiece?

You know, like the Mouth of Sauron is just a mouthpiece and nothing more. Even his name was forgotten.

Mouth of Sauron as analogy for lore master being the mouth of the GM...

Many a time, I have see this type of exchange with dealing with a lore master character archetype, in a game style that places control over the facts of the world with the GM, and not with the players.

The GM describes something the players are not familiar with in the game world. For example, this can be a new Japanese corporation in Cyberpunk, a scroll written in a non-roman alphabet, or a reference to some as-yet unfamiliar past event. Let this be the mystery.

One of the character has a knowledge based skill that would fit perfectly to determine whether or not said characters knows something about the mystery alluded above. In fact, it is more than that: the player wanted to play a lore-master archetype, in other words someone who knows those things. Maybe they are gridlinked, maybe they have spend all their live inside a library, maybe they just read the right set of eldritch books. Whatever, the situation is that the character should know that information but the player does not.

Back to the mystery. Whether or not the dice roll to pass the skill test was successful or not+, the GM is left with either: 

(i) Tell all the players a the same time, speaking in the voice of the character. Thus making the lore master character a glorified NPC a la Mouth Of Sauron. 

(ii) Take the lore master out of the room, tell them the information. Then correct things they have either missed, or misremembered, or got confused when they tell the rest of the players. This is tedious and takes way too much time. 

(iii) Be omniscient and have given said lore master player all the information they need at the start of the game/session. (Yeah, right.)

None of those solutions appeal to me for the reasons given.


+: The way I handle the situation is that the player always gets some true information but the amount of false information increases based on the degree of failure of the roll. Never is there a point where no true information is ever passed. Edge cases are not covered here...

3 edited title
source | link

Enhance the role of the lore master character archetype when the GM controls the facts

Many a time, I have see this type of exchange with dealing with a lore master character archetype, in a game style that places control over the facts of the world with the GM, and not with the players.

The GM describes something the players are not familiar with in the game world. For example, this can be a new Japanese corporation in Cyberpunk, a scroll written in a non-roman alphabet, or a reference to some as-yet unfamiliar past event. Let this be the mystery.

One of the character has a knowledge based skill that would fit perfectly to determine whether or not said characters knows something about the mystery alluded above. In fact, it is more than that: the player wanted to play a lore-master archetype, in other words someone who knows those things. Maybe they are gridlinked, maybe they have spend all their live inside a library, maybe they just read the right set of eldritch books. Whatever, the situation is that the character should know that information but the player does not.

Back to the mystery. Whether or not the dice roll to pass the skill test was successful or not+, the GM is left with either: (i) Tell all the players a the same time, speaking in the voice of the character. Thus making the lore master character a glorified NPC a la Mouth Of Sauron. (ii) Take the lore master out of the room, tell them the information. Then correct things they have either missed, or misremembered, or got confused when they tell the rest of the players. This is tedious and takes way too much time. (iii) Be omniscient and have given said lore master player all the information they need at the start of the game/session. Yeah, right⸮

None of those solutions appeal to me for the reasons given. Thus:

(TL;RD) How to stop lore master archetype characters becoming just the mouth of the GM?

You know, like the Mouth of Sauron is just a mouth piece and nothing more. Even his name was forgotten.

Mouth of Sauron as analogy for lore master being the mouth of the GM...


+: The way I handle the situation is that the player always gets some true information but the amount of false information increases based on the degree of failure of the roll. Never is there a point where no true information is ever passed. Edge cases are not covered here...

Enhance the role of the lore master character archetype

Many a time, I have see this type of exchange with dealing with a lore master character archetype.

The GM describes something the players are not familiar with in the game world. For example, this can be a new Japanese corporation in Cyberpunk, a scroll written in a non-roman alphabet, or a reference to some as-yet unfamiliar past event. Let this be the mystery.

One of the character has a knowledge based skill that would fit perfectly to determine whether or not said characters knows something about the mystery alluded above. In fact, it is more than that: the player wanted to play a lore-master archetype, in other words someone who knows those things. Maybe they are gridlinked, maybe they have spend all their live inside a library, maybe they just read the right set of eldritch books. Whatever, the situation is that the character should know that information but the player does not.

Back to the mystery. Whether or not the dice roll to pass the skill test was successful or not+, the GM is left with either: (i) Tell all the players a the same time, speaking in the voice of the character. Thus making the lore master character a glorified NPC a la Mouth Of Sauron. (ii) Take the lore master out of the room, tell them the information. Then correct things they have either missed, or misremembered, or got confused when they tell the rest of the players. This is tedious and takes way too much time. (iii) Be omniscient and have given said lore master player all the information they need at the start of the game/session. Yeah, right⸮

None of those solutions appeal to me for the reasons given. Thus:

(TL;RD) How to stop lore master archetype characters becoming just the mouth of the GM?

You know, like the Mouth of Sauron is just a mouth piece and nothing more. Even his name was forgotten.

Mouth of Sauron as analogy for lore master being the mouth of the GM...


+: The way I handle the situation is that the player always gets some true information but the amount of false information increases based on the degree of failure of the roll. Never is there a point where no true information is ever passed. Edge cases are not covered here...

Enhance the role of the lore master character archetype when the GM controls the facts

Many a time, I have see this type of exchange with dealing with a lore master character archetype, in a game style that places control over the facts of the world with the GM, and not with the players.

The GM describes something the players are not familiar with in the game world. For example, this can be a new Japanese corporation in Cyberpunk, a scroll written in a non-roman alphabet, or a reference to some as-yet unfamiliar past event. Let this be the mystery.

One of the character has a knowledge based skill that would fit perfectly to determine whether or not said characters knows something about the mystery alluded above. In fact, it is more than that: the player wanted to play a lore-master archetype, in other words someone who knows those things. Maybe they are gridlinked, maybe they have spend all their live inside a library, maybe they just read the right set of eldritch books. Whatever, the situation is that the character should know that information but the player does not.

Back to the mystery. Whether or not the dice roll to pass the skill test was successful or not+, the GM is left with either: (i) Tell all the players a the same time, speaking in the voice of the character. Thus making the lore master character a glorified NPC a la Mouth Of Sauron. (ii) Take the lore master out of the room, tell them the information. Then correct things they have either missed, or misremembered, or got confused when they tell the rest of the players. This is tedious and takes way too much time. (iii) Be omniscient and have given said lore master player all the information they need at the start of the game/session. Yeah, right⸮

None of those solutions appeal to me for the reasons given. Thus:

(TL;RD) How to stop lore master archetype characters becoming just the mouth of the GM?

You know, like the Mouth of Sauron is just a mouth piece and nothing more. Even his name was forgotten.

Mouth of Sauron as analogy for lore master being the mouth of the GM...


+: The way I handle the situation is that the player always gets some true information but the amount of false information increases based on the degree of failure of the roll. Never is there a point where no true information is ever passed. Edge cases are not covered here...

2 edited title
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