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As the title states, I'm wondering whether or not a Medium titan fighter can wield a Huge bastard sword.

Rules-as-written states you can wield a weapon one size category larger by staging it up and adding a penalty. For example, a light weapon becomes 1-handed, a 1-handed weapon becomes 2-handed, and 2-handed weapons are impossible.

With the feat Exotic Weapon Proficiency (bastard sword), you can treat the bastard sword as a 1-handed martial weapon. That said, if you have that feat could you, in theory. wield it two-handed if it were bigger than your own size?

If you can, you could—once again, in theory—with the feat Exotic Weapon Proficiency (bastard sword) also wield a Huge bastard sword as a 2-handed Large weapon, which is what a titan fighter is built to wield.

If this is allowable, what would the penalty on attack rolls be for wielding such an awesome blade?

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  • \$\begingroup\$ The Biggest reason I'm attempting this is because i want to wield a weapon that does "collusus" sized damage. Through the use of Impact and enlarge person. \$\endgroup\$ – Richard Fitzinwell Aug 10 '17 at 5:59
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    \$\begingroup\$ This question and this question may also be of interest. \$\endgroup\$ – Hey I Can Chan Aug 10 '17 at 8:43
  • \$\begingroup\$ I've built that exact setup OP. It's... good. More fun than powerful in a lot of cases, but definitely pretty strong. Bastard Swords have the best dice for it being the heaviest hitting 1-handers. \$\endgroup\$ – Ifusaso Aug 10 '17 at 11:44
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It's too big!

The fighter archetype titan fighter gains at level 1 the extraordinary ability giant weapon wielder that, in part, says that the creature

can wield two-handed melee weapons intended for creatures one size category larger than himself, treating them as two-handed weapons. He takes an additional –2 penalty on attack rolls when using an over-sized two-handed weapon.

(Emphasis mine.) According to the , the extraordinary ability giant weapon wielder doesn't apply when a Medium creature attempts to wield a weapon designed for a Huge creature. Huge is two size categories bigger than Medium.

However, a house rule that allows a the special ability giant weapon wielder to function in the fashion the question describes is unlikely to be unbalanced, especially if, for example, the rest of the party is casting spells.

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  • \$\begingroup\$ In the "Inappropriately Sized Weapons" the example given is "For example, a Small creature would wield a Medium one-handed weapon as a two-handed weapon." As the class feature state: can wield two-handed melee weapons intended for creatures one size category larger than himself. I dont think is unreasonable to think that a Huge 1-handed is for all purposes a large 2-handed and so being a 2-handed to a large creature, able to be used be a mediun titan fighter \$\endgroup\$ – Eldhelion Nov 6 at 16:19
  • \$\begingroup\$ @Eldhelion Actually, that's exactly how it was — a halfling's greatsword was a human's longsword, for instance — before the 3.5 revision of Dungeons & Dragons, Third Edition. Changed by the revision — therefore adopted by Pathfinder — this became the intended wielder's size rather than the weapon's size. I mean, yeah, it's a little silly, but it prevents a lot of confusion. \$\endgroup\$ – Hey I Can Chan Nov 6 at 16:28
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By RAW. The Bastard Sword is a one handed weapon

Taking Exotic Weapon Proeficiency just allows you to wield it. If you dont have EWP you'll have to wield it two-handed as a martial weapon, but then it would be the same as wielding a Greatsword.

A Large Bastard Sword is still a one handed weapon for all intent and purpose but Medium creatures (which have EWP) can wield it as a Two-handed weapon with a penalty.

Furthermore, the Giant Weapon Wielder (Ex) ability only allows you to wield two-handed weapon of only one size larger than you are

Giant Weapon Wielder (Ex)

At 1st level, a titan fighter can wield two-handed melee weapons intended for creatures one size category larger than himself, treating them as two-handed weapons. He takes an additional –2 penalty on attack rolls when using an over-sized two-handed weapon.

So, even as a Titan Fighter, you can't wield a Huge Bastard Sword. Titan fighters were designed to use Large Two-handed weapons, like Large Greatswords and the like.

Here is the relevant text about Inappropriately sized weapon

Inappropriately Sized Weapons: A creature can't make optimum use of a weapon that isn't properly sized for it. A cumulative –2 penalty applies on attack rolls for each size category of difference between the size of its intended wielder and the size of its actual wielder. If the creature isn't proficient with the weapon, a –4 nonproficiency penalty also applies.

The measure of how much effort it takes to use a weapon (whether the weapon is designated as a light, one-handed, or two-handed weapon for a particular wielder) is altered by one step for each size category of difference between the wielder's size and the size of the creature for which the weapon was designed. For example, a Small creature would wield a Medium one-handed weapon as a two-handed weapon. If a weapon's designation would be changed to something other than light, one-handed, or two-handed by this alteration, the creature can't wield the weapon at all.

If you really want to wield a Huge Weapon, you will have to enlarge yourself.

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Lets look at what we are actually talking about here since we are seeing yes and no, this is probably a DM discretion area.

So if we take our weapons and convert them to Large/Huge stats are as follows....

GS 2d6->3d6 / 8lbs->16lbs / 50gp->100gp

BS 1d10->2d8->3d8 / 6lbs->12lbs->24lbs / 35gp->70gp->140gp

Here you can find the rules for such conversions.

So overall, they don't seem to horribly broken from one to the other, a big thing to take into account being the rules of over-sized weapons

Inappropriately Sized Weapons: A creature can't make optimum use of a weapon that isn't properly sized for it. A cumulative –2 penalty applies on attack rolls for each size category of difference between the size of its intended wielder and the size of its actual wielder. If the creature isn't proficient with the weapon, a –4 nonproficiency penalty also applies.

So in reality its a cumulative -2 for each size category above intended. All together that looks like...

  • -2 large
  • -2 Huge
  • -2 Two handed Weapon

This makes using a Huge Bastard sword -6 bonus

Your only really adding a potential for 2 more max damage, and adding a -2 bonus, when compared to using the rules as intended for a Large Great Sword

(then again this is all ONLY IF the DM allows for a Huge weapon to be used Two Handed, as the rules state clearly only one size category, however this is a pretty small thing to fudge)

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  • \$\begingroup\$ Welcome to the site! Take the tour. To make this answer stand alone, it sounds like it would benefit from having a line at the beginning saying something like No, but if the GM allows it, it's not unbalanced. Thank you for participating and have fun! \$\endgroup\$ – Hey I Can Chan Sep 22 '17 at 13:58
  • \$\begingroup\$ @Joking If you continue reading on the link you provided, you will see the following line at the end: " If a weapon's designation would be changed to something other than light, one-handed, or two-handed by this alteration, the creature can't wield the weapon at all." So, if the size difference brings the weapon to something larger than a two-handed weapon, a character cannot wield it. It's not simply a matter of stacking penalties. \$\endgroup\$ – ShadowKras Sep 22 '17 at 14:38
  • \$\begingroup\$ A bastard word is a one-handed weapon (if exotic) for a huge creature, two steps (one-handed -> two-handed -> ?????) would make it larger than a two-handed weapon. There are two steps between Huge and Medium (medium -> large -> huge). And thus, it cannot be wielded. If treated as a two-handed weapon (martial), then that makes it three steps, even worse. \$\endgroup\$ – ShadowKras Sep 22 '17 at 14:41
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Yes, by using your Class Feature and the rules about 2-Handing a 1-Handed Weapon, you can wield a Huge Bastard Sword.

Make sure you stack the penalties because you're using:

Inappropriately Sized Weapons:

A creature can't make optimum use of a weapon that isn't properly sized for it. A cumulative –2 penalty applies on attack rolls for each size category of difference between the size of its intended wielder and the size of its actual wielder. If the creature isn't proficient with the weapon, a –4 nonproficiency penalty also applies.

The measure of how much effort it takes to use a weapon (whether the weapon is designated as a light, one-handed, or two-handed weapon for a particular wielder) is altered by one step for each size category of difference between the wielder's size and the size of the creature for which the weapon was designed. For example, a Small creature would wield a Medium one-handed weapon as a two-handed weapon. If a weapon's designation would be changed to something other than light, one-handed, or two-handed by this alteration, the creature can't wield the weapon at all.

As well as:

Giant Weapon Wielder (Ex)

At 1st level, a titan fighter can wield two-handed melee weapons intended for creatures one size category larger than himself, treating them as two-handed weapons. He takes an additional –2 penalty on attack rolls when using an over-sized two-handed weapon.

To summarize:

  • Without proficiency, a Medium Bastard Sword is a 2-handed weapon.
  • With proficiency, a Medium Bastard Sword is a 1-handed weapon.
  • With proficiency, a Large Bastard Sword is a 2-handed weapon.
  • With proficiency, a Huge Bastard Sword can be used because of Giant Weapon Wielder.
  • Total attack penalty: -4
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  • \$\begingroup\$ You make a few good points but you seem to have missed one. The fact that you can only use Giant Weapon Wielder (Ex) for two-handed weapons of one size larger than you. So you may use a Large Bastard Sword as a 2-handed weapon but that would be it. \$\endgroup\$ – Dastardly Aug 10 '17 at 11:49
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    \$\begingroup\$ No, I read your answer before posting. We'll see what the community thinks. \$\endgroup\$ – Ifusaso Aug 10 '17 at 12:53
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    \$\begingroup\$ True true ! But I still think there is an error in your interpretation of the ability. \$\endgroup\$ – Dastardly Aug 10 '17 at 12:55

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