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I've been trying to make sense of the Tapestry's structure in Mage the Ascension as described in the 20th anniversary edition, but there some points I'm not sure I understood correctly.

So, if I get it right, the three Umbrae (High, Middle and Low Umbra) and the Near Umbra are some sort of different dimensions, in the pop culture usually understands the expression "different dimension", that is, like parallel planes of some kind. On the other hand, the Deep Umbra and the Horizons are in "our plane plane of existence", as the book describes the First Horizon being located at the end of Earth's atmosphere and Far Horizon at the asteroid's belt after Pluto. Everything beyond that is the Deep Umbra, and Zones like the Digital Web are limited areas with certain characteristics spread throughout our plane and the Umbrae. There is a nice pic I found online displaying the whole thing:

Horizons and Deep Umbra

On the other hand,the book also states that Horizon is the region that separates the three Umbrae from one another, and that's where it starts getting confusing for me. So either my interpretation of the three Umbrae Realms as parallel planes is wrong or Horizon isn't exactly a physical region in our solar system. Is Horizon both in "this dimension" and in the other Umbrae, in way it intersects all of them? How do you interpret all this?

I guess this is all probably meant to be confusing, as many other things in the World of Darkness, but I would like to know what is your take in all this.

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  • \$\begingroup\$ There appear to be two distinct questions in here. We have a one-question, one-post site model, so if you could edit this post to be a single question and post the other question in its own post, you'll get better, more focused answers faster. \$\endgroup\$ – SevenSidedDie Sep 29 '17 at 0:03
  • \$\begingroup\$ Thanks! I've released the hold on answers now that it's clear what they should be specifically focused on tackling. \$\endgroup\$ – SevenSidedDie Sep 29 '17 at 0:10
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    \$\begingroup\$ Done. Didn't know about the one question rule. I use mostly math.stackexchange where the one-question, one-post structure always seemed more like a natural thing than an actual rule. Sorry about that. \$\endgroup\$ – Douglas Finamore Sep 29 '17 at 0:11
  • \$\begingroup\$ No apologies necessary. No harm done, so no foul. :) \$\endgroup\$ – SevenSidedDie Sep 29 '17 at 3:14
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    \$\begingroup\$ I answered something similar in another post, it may be helpful: rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/60280/… \$\endgroup\$ – Random Sep 30 '17 at 8:44
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Douglas. That image you're using is one I created for the Unofficial White Wolf Wiki. I founded the Wiki, work for the current publishers of Mage, and 2001's Guide to the Traditions was my first RPG credit. I've been steeped in Mage lore for a very long time.

Earlier books use "Horizon" a little liberally and inconsistently. I'm pretty sure it wasn't until Revised Edition (2000) that it was formalized into "First Horizon," "True Horizon" and "Far Horizon" as three separate areas. They do not, however, occupy our physical reality (although the Gauntlet is thin enough in space that finding your way into the Horizon is pretty easy). The Horizon is the "Umbra" of space and is usually reached the same way. The Far Horizon is in the Asteroid Belt between Mars and Jupiter, not the Kuiper Belt. The four gas giants and Pluto are technically in the Deep Umbra rather than in Etherspace.

I can't recall any references to the Horizon being what separates the three Near Umbrae. Each of the Horizons is outside the Near Umbra system.

I hope that answers your question.

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  • \$\begingroup\$ I see. So sticking to my analogy with parallel planes, I should see each of the Near Umbrae not as the entire plane, but only as the region in the that plane corresponding to about the same region as Earth, and the Horizon is the rest? If that's the case, then it makes much more sense to me now. \$\endgroup\$ – Douglas Finamore Sep 29 '17 at 13:32
  • \$\begingroup\$ About Horizon separating the Umbrae, I actually read it in the white wolf wikia and assumed it was from some book, but after your clarification I think it is meant to separate the Near Umbrae and the Deep Umbra: whitewolf.wikia.com/wiki/Horizon_(cWOD) \$\endgroup\$ – Douglas Finamore Sep 29 '17 at 13:34

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