As a rogue, we get the proficiency to use Hand crossbow (which is an exotic weapon). And so can a rogue use a Repeating hand crossbow (also list as an exotic weapon) without handicap? Or would we have to gain a proficiency exotic in this kind of weapon to use it?

TL;DR: Is the Repeating hand crossbow still a Hand crossbow?

  • \$\begingroup\$ I removed the non-question information from the question. If you’d like to say something about why you chose an answer, you can leave a comment under the answer you chose; I see you’ve already done that. \$\endgroup\$ – SevenSidedDie Nov 5 '18 at 17:04

No, it's not sufficient

(Since so many comments are arguments about whether it would make sense to allow it anyway: You are probably right! I was answering with the intent to clarify the rules, nothing prevents you from asking your GM to allow this at your table.)

"repeating" is not a modifier (trip, reach, etc. are explicitly listed as such), a Repeating Crossbow is listed as its own entry in the weapons table.

In contrast, a Composite Longbow has the following rule:

For purposes of Weapon Proficiency and similar feats, a composite longbow is treated as if it were a longbow.

A Repeating Crossbow does not have a similar rule, so I don't see why your rogue should have Proficiency. Your he would need to choose Exotic Weapon Proficiency, once for each type of exotic weapon he wants to use proficiently.

By the way, the Core Rulebook does not mention a "Repeating Hand Crossbow", just "Hand Crossbow" and "Light/Heavy Repeating Crossbow".

  • 1
    \$\begingroup\$ I feel like your answer is the one which match the rules to the core without interpretation. While the answer from @linksassin is more logical and more practical but don't strictly follow the book. As my GM seems to be one to follow rules to the core in place of "fixing" them to be more logical, I will take your answer. \$\endgroup\$ – vdubus Nov 3 '18 at 10:49
  • \$\begingroup\$ Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat. \$\endgroup\$ – SevenSidedDie Nov 5 '18 at 17:06

By RAW, it is not sufficient

As outlined by Silverclaw, the rules officially state that Repeating crossbows require Exotic Weapon Proficiency to use. However as this makes the weapon fundamentally worse than a longbow and costs additional feat to boot, I would house rule to allow it. There is some supporting evidence that this should be allowed.

The important text for Repeating Hand Crossbow

This weapon functions identically to a repeating heavy crossbow, except its damage, critical, and range values are equivalent to those of a hand crossbow instead.

The Repeating Heavy Crossbow has the following rule.

You can fire a repeating crossbow with one hand or fire a repeating crossbow in each hand in the same manner as you would a normal crossbow of the same size. However, you must fire the weapon with two hands in order to use the reloading lever, and you must use two hands to load a new case of bolts.

So yes your proficiency with a Hand Crossbow should be enough to use a Repeating Hand Crossbow. However this is a homebrew ruling and will require DM approval.

  • \$\begingroup\$ It is a modifier? So does it follow the rules for weapons mod, meaning I would need a feat like Weapon Adept or Modified Weapon Proficiency to be able to use it? \$\endgroup\$ – vdubus Nov 3 '18 at 9:42
  • \$\begingroup\$ @vdubus Apologies, Modifier was a poor choice of words. But the proficiencies definitely count. \$\endgroup\$ – linksassin Nov 4 '18 at 12:54
  • \$\begingroup\$ I don't think the rule you've quoted for the Repeating Heavy Crossbow is at all relevant here. That rule is talking about the number of hands you need to use to shoot it (it's referencing a rule from the Heavy Crossbow that lets you shoot with one hand rather than two at a penalty). It doesn't mean that everyone who is proficient with a Heavy Crossbow (a simple weapon) is also proficient with Repeating Heavy Crossbows (an exotic weapon). \$\endgroup\$ – Blckknght Nov 4 '18 at 18:15
  • \$\begingroup\$ @Blckknght "in the same manner" implies they are the same. And purely from a logic standpoint a repeating crossbow and a regular crossbow take the same skillset to use. \$\endgroup\$ – linksassin Nov 4 '18 at 23:26
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    \$\begingroup\$ No, that's completely wrong. The rules are that repeating crossbows are exotic weapons, so you need a weapon-specific proficiency to use them. The thing that works "in the same manner" is that you can shoot (but not reload) them with one hand. \$\endgroup\$ – Blckknght Nov 5 '18 at 0:27

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