Specific Questions

  1. Are there any mechanics for custom vehicles in Paizo's Pathfinder rules?

  2. Are there any vehicles of Medium or smaller size in Paizo's Pathfinder rules?

  3. Are there any enhanced rules tied to piloting/driving a vehicle outside of Ultimate Combat?

  4. Are there any mechanics on disguising a vehicle/object that would make sharing a disguise with one explicitly follow other rules or be potentially invalid?

I am seeking guidance on how to bring the home-brew vehicle below more in line with the mechanics and rules in the official materials. I'm giving too much detail (probably) in the hopes it helps catch things I failed to ask explicitly.

Acknowledging the other Pathfinder vehicle threads I benefited from reading.

  • Rules on damaging vehicles were discussed here.
  • Additional vehicles tied to the high seas were discussed here.
  • Some 3.5e vehicle details were brought up here.

All three were insightful, though they didn't answer my questions above.

A Vehicle of Unusual Size (and Design)

I'm attempting to answer my own rules question best I can, but I do want help making sure I got this all right.

I'm specifically attempting to make a vehicle that fits into a single square and is Medium-sized.

Any vehicle that takes up 2 or more squares is already covered by the rules. Nothing goes into Medium. The rules also give some details on how a vehicle might be altered, and on what statistics to track, but don't explicitly play out how mechanics might combine. Here is my best attempt at hitting all those details.

Since something occupying 1 square is typically Medium-sized or smaller, I am treating a 1-square vehicle as Medium-sized. I wish there were explicitly a Medium vehicle to reference in the rules, but there isn't one I saw.

But... Why?

I've drafted up a vehicle inspired by three goblins trying to fit in a trenchcoat. You can judge me.

The base cost is being assumed at 250gp, based on the costs worked into other vehicles for similar features, including Smuggler's Wagon at medium effectiveness. I would love something more reliable as a measure. There was no way to be sure this was exactly right.

The enhanced version I included has that cost doubled based on a Smuggler's Wagon at high concealment. The enhanced vehicle is also made of Mithral, and the cost for that is based off the +9,000gp cost for a suit of heavy armor. There were no 'weight' statistics on vehicles to do it by pound.

Another rule of interest: Creatures propulsion can be in teams. I didn't find any other rules that refer to the concept of teams, to verify it working for pushing a vehicle.

The Person Suit

Medium land vehicle

Squares 1 (5 ft. by 5 ft.;6 feet high); Cost 250 gp (Basic), 9,500 gp (Enhanced)


AC 10; Hardness 0 (basic), AC 10; Hardness 15 (enhanced)

(The base AC is based on the size, and doesn't factor in the driver's skill. Hardness is inherited from the material)

hp 15 (7) (basic), 30 (14) (enhanced) (Determined by the size and material)

Base Save +0 (This bonus was entirely random in the sample entries, so I left it alone)

Defensive Abilities bounce, disguised?, compact


Maximum Speed 60 ft. (muscle); Acceleration 15 ft. (muscle) (Reviewing existing vehicles, all pushed vehicles with 1+ crew dedicated to movement per 1 square of space had these statistics)

CMB +0; CMD 10 (This is based on the vehicle size)

Offensive Abilities armed, about face


This appears to be a vaguely barrel-shaped Medium-sized humanoid, covered in a long robe and low-sitting wide-brimmed hat that obscure them from top to bottom from view. Enhanced versions are more convincingly humanoid, but both versions move unnaturally as if riding along on wheels and small sets of feet. Creatures inside The People Suit gain either total cover (the crew) or cover (the driver).

Propulsion muscle (pushed; 2 Small creature)

Driving Check Profession (driver)

Forward Facing The direction in which the vehicle last moved

Driving Device a single lever combined with leaning to tilt the vehicle

Driving Space the top deck of the space; the lever extends through all decks

Crew 2

Decks 3

Bounce (Ex) The Person Suit is constructed to be springy and easy to maneuver, which deprives it of the force and impact of a standard vehicle. The Person Suit is treated like a creature if impacted by another vehicle, and cannot perform vehicle maneuvers. The Person Suit can be targeted by any maneuver that forces movement as if it were a creature, and accelerates or decelerates based on the movement inflicted in the direction chosen.

Disguised? (Ex): The Person Suit is not all it seems, and this grants it certain benefits. The Person Suit may be used as part of a Medium-sized disguise for the driver, negating the size penalty on the check. The Person Suit may also attempt stealth checks, using the stealth skill of the driver. Whenever The Person Suits moves, everyone nearby receives a +10 to perception to overcome the disguise or stealth check. This bonus is reduced to +5 for the Enhanced version.

Compact (Ex): The Person Suit is designed to fit three small creatures in cramped conditions. A Medium or larger creature cannot fit inside of this vehicle to use it. Should a creature inside the vehicle suddenly increase in size, the vehicle falls apart and spills the crew and driver out in a three space line. It takes ten minutes to reassemble the vehicle should this happen.

Armed (Ex): The Person Suit has two arm-like appendages that can be equipped with a one-handed melee weapon and a shield, or two one-handed melee weapons. If given a shield, the shield's bonuses apply to the vehicle. If given one or more weapons, a special attack maneuver may be attempted by the driver as a standard action. All adjacent creatures of Medium size or larger must make a Reflex Save vs (10 + 1/2 Profession (driver) ranks + Wis) or take damage from all of the held weapons. Weapon enhancements do not increase the DC of this attack, but do apply to any damage dealt.

About Face (Ex): The driver may change the facing of the vehicle on their turn as part of an accelerate check. This does not change the direction in which the vehicle was moving previously, and attempting to accelerate in the opposite direction of ongoing movement is treated as a decelerate check. Because of the unorthodox way in which a People Suit can swivel and change the direction of the body, it receives +4 to AC against attacks of opportunity triggered by movement.

  • 3
    \$\begingroup\$ Welcome to the site! Take the tour. The work on this is great—thank you for sharing! Nonetheless, the site prefers questions that are obvious, and this question may be improved by enumerating the actual questions in a summary. That is, unfortunately, Please give me your guidance on if I am missing details or how to do this better isn't the kind of semi-question that's a good fit for the site. Can the actual questions be more specific? Thank you for participating and have fun! (Also, I assume that it's the 3 decks that lets 3 Small creatures fit into 1 square, yes?) \$\endgroup\$ Nov 2, 2019 at 21:48
  • \$\begingroup\$ Thanks for the response, and I'll start looking at how to be more specific and direct in the question. Yes, the 3 decks is how I'm justifying the 3 small creatures in 1 square. Based on other vehicles that use similar mechanics with heights tied appropriate for medium creatures. \$\endgroup\$
    – Stephen R
    Nov 2, 2019 at 21:57

1 Answer 1


Have fun

To your questions:

  1. The vehicles for Pathfinder can be found here, and the full vehicle rules can be found here, under Other Rules Systems / Vehicles. As far as I can tell, they do not contain specific rules for designing new, custom vehicles.

  2. The Table: Vehicle Size by Squares categorizes vehicles as either Large, Huge, Gargantuan or Colossal, so no, there are no Medium sized or smaller vehicles in the rules.

  3. The full vehicle rules cited above do provide detailed rules for driving and maneuvering vehicles, including things like propusion and driving checks, maneuvering air or water currents, propulsion by air, current, muscle (pulling, pushing), and other means (magic, alchemy), turning, and special rules for propulsion devices like sails and engines and driving devices like rigging, steering wheels, rudders, throttles etc.

  4. Camouflage and disguise of vehicles are not treated in the vehicle rules. You would need to apply general rules for doing so.

As for your own try on this, if this is mostly for having fun at your table, and considering this is a very unusual kind of vehicle that has little in terms of comparables, this seems a reasonable take on it. (I guess the ship for this answer being in time to be that useful to you has anyways long sailed, or maybe I should say the Person Suit has long shambled off...)

You might be interested in Powered Armor from the Technology Guide, which coincidentially also mentions that "Rumors persist of variant forms of powered armor, including suits sized for giants or that can function as vehicles for multiple creatures.", but provides no rules for them.


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