5
\$\begingroup\$

Insightful Strike, from the Tome of Battle's Swordsage class, says:

At 4th level, you can add your Wisdom modifier as a bonus on damage rolls whenever you execute a strike from the chosen discipline.

At 12th level, you can choose a second discipline to which this ability applies.

Some maneuvers have you roll for ability score damage, like Mind Strike. (Others, like Drain Vitality do not!)

Additionally, checking the d20srd for damage, there is a section for ability score damage. This leads me to think rolling for ability score damage and weapon damage fall under "damage rolls."

Does this mean that the insightful strike feature can be used both on weapon damage AND ability score damage in maneuvers, so long as a die is rolled? Seems to me like yes, but was wondering if there was a specific definition for "damage rolls" which limit this to damage rolls for weapons.

Improve this question
\$\endgroup\$
5
  • 1
    \$\begingroup\$ We try to avoid using code formatting on plaintext for accessibility reasons. \$\endgroup\$
    – Thomas Markov
    Aug 3, 2022 at 21:00
  • \$\begingroup\$ @ThomasMarkov Good to know! \$\endgroup\$
    – PipperChip
    Aug 3, 2022 at 21:06
  • 1
    \$\begingroup\$ Also, dndtools engages in copyright infringement, so we do not allow links there on this site. Anyone answering this question should be familiar with Tome of Battle anyway. \$\endgroup\$
    – KRyan
    Aug 3, 2022 at 21:10
  • \$\begingroup\$ @kryan Well, I certainly am learning a lot from this question! Good catch. \$\endgroup\$
    – PipperChip
    Aug 3, 2022 at 21:24
  • 2
    \$\begingroup\$ Similar yet far broader question. \$\endgroup\$
    – Hey I Can Chan
    Aug 4, 2022 at 1:30

1 Answer 1

Reset to default
2
\$\begingroup\$

This is only relevant to 3 maneuvers: five-shadow creeping ice enervation strike, hamstring attack, and mind strike. The ability damage dealt by those maneuvers is a damage roll, so yes.

It's possible that this wasn't the intent. By damage roll I think the writer probably meant "weapon damage roll", perceiving the rider effect as a separate category. But the insightful strike class feature is worded so broadly that there's no rules-as-written basis for making that distinction.

Improve this answer
\$\endgroup\$
4
  • \$\begingroup\$ Even if it's only 3 strikes, this makes them much more powerful! \$\endgroup\$
    – PipperChip
    Aug 9, 2022 at 18:34
  • 1
    \$\begingroup\$ It's a neat thing to notice, but not overpowered. Mind strike and hamstring are useless otherwise and this merely makes them viable -- but still probably worse than some other maneuvers of their level (like the other 2 Diamond Mind strikes at 4th, or swooping dragon strike and avalanche of blades at 7th). Five shadow is good against low Fort enemies and this makes it better, but since the other SH strikes suck, putting your insightful strike into this discipline means you won't see value from it on other maneuvers. \$\endgroup\$
    – nimbus
    Aug 9, 2022 at 19:09
  • \$\begingroup\$ It quickly gets overpowered when people add other modifiers like sneak attack, but the question is not about balance but rules :) \$\endgroup\$
    – Wannabe Warlock
    Aug 10, 2022 at 21:12
  • 1
    \$\begingroup\$ The same logic doesn't apply to sneak attack, which says "The rogue’s attack deals extra damage." The ability damage dealt by these maneuvers isn't damage dealt by an attack, it's an extra effect that occurs if your attack hits and deals damage. Insightful strike applies because it simply says: "...damage rolls whenever you execute a strike from the chosen discipline," which would include all damage rolls made as part of the strike. \$\endgroup\$
    – nimbus
    Aug 13, 2022 at 16:11

You must log in to answer this question.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged .