Mountain Stance gives, among other things:

you gain a +4 item bonus to AC and a +2 circumstance bonus to any defenses against being Shoved or Tripped.

Some creatures, like a wolf, have the knockdown property.

As I read the rules, Mountain Stance wouldn't provide any benefit against knockdown. One of my player is a bit frustrated that his features supposed to protect him against being tripped (as encountering creatures with this feature has been more common than foes who use the Trip action in my campaign so far).

Do you know of a house-rule (or an official ruling if I got it wrong) that would help?

  • 7
    \$\begingroup\$ But it is protecting him. To use Knockdown, they have to hit him, and he has +4 AC, a higher bonus than what he has against separate Trip attempts. (Not sure if this is worth an answer, you might have considered it already, but can write it up if you want.) \$\endgroup\$
    – Szega
    Commented Apr 19, 2023 at 8:46
  • 2
    \$\begingroup\$ @Szega you are right, but this still feels bad. \$\endgroup\$ Commented Apr 19, 2023 at 13:25

2 Answers 2


The official rules

You are right, Knockdown does not need a check of any kind, so Mountain Stance does nothing in this regard. Its main benefit is being able to start with lower Dex, and it does that perferctly.

This works both ways

A tiny Sprite PC does not need to make a check when he critically hits an Ancient Gold Dragon (Gargantuan) with a Flail, it will just be prone.

The players should just accept this, they will not be complaining when the rules favor them.

The house rule

A Trip attempt fails about 50% of the time. A +2 circumstance bonus against trips changes this to 60%, which is a 20% improvement. Based on this if you insist on giving the player something (again, I would not), just let him roll a DC 17 flat check. If he succeeds, he stays standing.

  • 2
    \$\begingroup\$ The DC 17 Flat check is in line with other bonuses available against Conditions, such as Humans' Stubborn Persistence... but those are usually fairly high level abilities. That being said, there is a 7th level Acrobatics Feat that reduces the penalties for being Prone significantly, and it's the second easiest Condition to remove (after Frightened), so avoiding it should be commensurately less valuable. \$\endgroup\$ Commented Apr 19, 2023 at 21:10

The new rules

Based on the Remaster Preview, paizo listened to you:

Knockdown: [...] The monster attempts to Trip the creature. This attempt neither applies nor counts toward the monster’s multiple attack penalty

Grab and Push (Shove is also renamed now) is the similar.

  • 4
    \$\begingroup\$ Commemorating the first remaster-based answer! \$\endgroup\$
    – Ruse
    Commented Jul 26, 2023 at 18:43

You must log in to answer this question.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged .