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A shimmering aura takes the shape of a multilegged creature from night­ mare, instantly leaping into battle against your foes.

This spell creates a manifestation of the dreamspace that attacks your enemies. A dream spirit is treated as an incorporeal creature that has your hit points and the AC you would have if you were incorporeal (it loses any armor bonus or natural armor bonus you have but gains a deflection bonus equal to your Charisma modifier or +1, whichever is greater).

The dream spirit appears where you designate and acts immediately, on your turn. It attacks your opponents to the best of its ability. A dream spirit has a single incorporeal touch attack that uses your base attack bonus plus Dexter­ity modifier and deals ld6 points of damage, plus 1 per two levels (maximum 1d6 + 10).

As a free action, you can mentally direct a dream spirit not to attack, to attack particular enemies, or to perform other actions. The dream spirit acts normally on the last round of the spell's duration and dissipates at the end of its turn.

If a dream spirit is reduced to 0 hit points, this spell ends. If the distance between you and the dream spirit ever exceeds the spell's range, the dream spirit winks out and the spell ends.

Dream spirits are material in nature, and so are not affected by dismissal and similar effects. They are not sub­ject to effects that affect outsiders.

What is the Dream Spirit's movespeed? Does it move or does it instantly teleport next to the guy you order it to attack?

As a general rule, can all incorporeals fly?

Incorporeal creatures pass through and operate in water as easily as they do in air. Incorporeal creatures cannot fall or take falling damage.

this is from the general description of the incorporeal subtype. Cannot fall, move through water and air just as easily, doesn't this suggest that all incorporeals can fly? Cause moving through water = 3 dimensional movement, equal movement in water and air = 3 dimensional movement through air, and cannot fall = float

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  • \$\begingroup\$ There are basically two questions in your question. I suggest you to split them by editing out a part about an ability to fly, and then asking it as a separate question (regarding all incorporeals, not just the spirit). The main reason, this site behaves this way, is the fact, there may be people, able to answer one of your questions, but unable to answer the second one (or vise-versa). \$\endgroup\$ Nov 4, 2023 at 19:45
  • \$\begingroup\$ Long story short: 1) ask your DM, what speed the spirit has, if it even has one; 2) incorporeal creatures "fly", but don't fly (they don't have a fly speed). \$\endgroup\$ Nov 4, 2023 at 19:54
  • \$\begingroup\$ @annoyingimp what are your thoughts about Dream Spirit functioning like Spiritual Weapon? Spiritual Weapon has no move speed and can attack any creature within the spell's range no matter the distance. dnd.arkalseif.info/spells/players-handbook-v35--6/… \$\endgroup\$ Nov 6, 2023 at 2:46
  • \$\begingroup\$ It is as possible, as "it has your speed". But it is not an answer, just my 5 cents. As a side note: RPG:SE is generally against links to the sites, violating copyrights (like that, you have in an above comment). \$\endgroup\$ Nov 6, 2023 at 18:43

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The rules provide no direct guidance...

I can't find anything in the rules that answers your question:

  • There's nothing in the text of the spell that you've missed.
  • "Dream Spirit" isn't the name of a creature I've been able to find (i.e., the spell isn't referring to a creature or template from elsewhere in the rules where you would find the missing stats).
  • The Incorporeal subtype does not provide creatures with a movement speed, just alters their existing movement in various ways (allowing them to pass through solid objects and move at full speed when they cannot see).

...unless you use a generous interpretation of an ambiguous line from the Rules Compendium.

The Rules Compendium (p. 64) says:

Most incorporeal creatures can fly.

It doesn't elaborate at all; nothing about how to tell if any given incorporeal creature is one of the "most" that can fly, nothing about what speed they can fly at, nothing about maneuverability. Just that one sentence.

A generous DM might use this as a basis to give incorporeal creatures a flight speed, but the details would be up to the DM's discretion, since the rules again give no guidance.

As a DM, I would use the caster's speed(s).

Given that the spell uses your stats for various things (your HP, your attack bonus, the AC you would have if you were incorporeal), it seems that the spell is creating something like a dreamspace representation of the caster. Thus, I would rule that the spirit has your movement modes and speeds, in addition to the other stats it inherits from you.

This would be a ruling on my part, though. As far as I can tell, the spell's behavior is ambiguous as written.

Re: Incorporeal movement weirdness

Cannot fall, move through water and air just as easily, doesn't this suggest that all incorporeals can fly? Cause moving through water = 3 dimensional movement, equal movement in water and air = 3 dimensional movement through air, and cannot fall = float

The fact that incorporeal creatures "pass through and operate in water as easily as they do in air" doesn't read to me as if it gives them air-based options that they wouldn't have if they weren't incorporeal - it just removes the penalties that would normally apply to being underwater, allowing them to fly or walk underwater if they have fly or walk speeds, just as they would be able to above water.

I agree that it's hard to interpret what "cannot fall" would mean for a creature that can't fly, but going from that to "therefore all incorporeal creatures gain a flight speed" is too much of a stretch for me. I just read this as another case where the rules fail to fully spell out what they mean. Maybe some DMs would resolve this by giving all incorporeal creatures a flight speed, but I would call that a house rule similar to my "use the caster's speed(s)" suggestion above.

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  • \$\begingroup\$ Ruled as written, would this dream spirit have no movespeed or infinite movespeed? No movespeed is, since the spell description does not give it a movespeed and since there is no such thing as a default movespeed, ruled as written it would not have a movespeed and be a stationary attacker. Infinite movespeed is "you can mentally direct a dream spirit not to attack, to attack particular enemies," -> ordering it to attack an enemy teleports him next to it so it can attack it. So the spell moves it rather than the creature moving on its own. I'm leaning towards stationary. What is your opinion? \$\endgroup\$ Nov 6, 2023 at 1:11
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    \$\begingroup\$ As I tried to get at with my first header, I believe the answer is "the rules fail to specify." The spell makes no sense if the creature has no speed, but the rules don't give it a speed. A DM ruling is required for the spell to work. \$\endgroup\$
    – A_S00
    Nov 6, 2023 at 2:05
  • \$\begingroup\$ I don't think I was being clear. My bad. dnd.arkalseif.info/spells/players-handbook-v35--6/… What are your thoughts about Dream Spirit working like Spiritual Weapon? Spiritual Weapon works without a move speed. So would it be a valid argument to say by RAW, Dream Spirit works like Spiritual Weapon because it has no movespeed specified just like it? Immediately move next to the target no matter the distance. Or does spiritual weapon's effect text make it somehow not a good comparison to Dream Spirit? \$\endgroup\$ Nov 6, 2023 at 2:26
  • \$\begingroup\$ To put it another way, does Spiritual Weapon set a precedent that any spell that creates a creature, lets you direct targets, but does not specify a movespeed, makes the creature essentially teleport to any creature within the spell's range? \$\endgroup\$ Nov 6, 2023 at 2:33
  • \$\begingroup\$ I think that would be a fine way to rule, but I do not believe that it is RAW, because Dream Spirit lacks the text telling you how switching targets works ("Each round after the first, you can use a move action to redirect the weapon to a new target. If you do not, the weapon continues to attack the previous round's target. On any round that the weapon switches targets, it gets one attack."), and because Dream Spirit explicitly creates a creature (meaning it has to do all the stuff creatures do, like exist in a specific space), while Spiritual Weapon does not. \$\endgroup\$
    – A_S00
    Nov 6, 2023 at 2:34

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