Consider this example from the Rogue class traits:

Trained Skills: Stealth and Thievery. From the class skills list below, choose four more trained skills at 1st level.
    Class Skills: Acrobatics (Dex), Athletics (Str), Bluff (Cha), Dungeoneering (Wis), Insight (Wis), Intimidate (Cha), Perception (Wis), Stealth (Dex), Streetwise (Cha), Thievery (Dex)

The Rogue is trained in Stealth and Thievery. However, they're also included in the Class Skills section, and it invites you to: 'choose four more trained skills' from that list. This seems to be similar for all the classes.

So can you train Stealth and Thievery as a choice as well have it initially trained or the equivalent for other classes?


1 Answer 1


these class skill lists are redundant with the granted skills for several reasons.

  • Hybrid characters. Instead of creating separate class skills lists for hybrids, they just use the same skill lists and then you just don't get the automatic training.

  • Multiclass feats. Often these feats give you the opportunity train one skill off the class you're MCing into's feat list. It would be rather silly if you couldn't get thievery by MCing into a rogue, but you could by Mcing into another class that didn't get it automatically.

  • Certain feats specifically mention class skills. There is really only one of these that doesn't fall into the category above,(Academy Prodigy from Dragon 390), but it does merit a mention.

I did some quick checking on C. Ross's idea that the class skill list will stay consistent between character variants, but that the skills you get automatically would change. I've actually found something of the opposite to be true. It seems that the variants tend to get the automatic powers, but might have a different skill list.

To specifically answer your question, no you can't double train a stat. Trained is a specific condition for a stat with specific meaning, it doesn't make sense to have something trained twice. Some classes give specific choices to start out (the Ranger gets either dungeoneering or nature), both skills are class skills so that gives the opportunity for them to choose one or both (using one of their other training spots).


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