If I use Furious Smash with Cruel Cut Style, am I the source of the ongoing damage that I'm granting my ally's attack? I was considering taking Disciple of Torment so that while the ongoing damage from my Furious Smash is active, the enemies grant combat advantage.

Furious Smash (Player's Handbook, page 145):

Hit: Strength modifier damage. Choose an ally adjacent to you or to the target. The ally gains a power bonus to the next attack roll and damage roll that he or she makes against the target before the end of his or her next turn. The power bonus equals your Charisma modifier.

Cruel Cut Style (Cruel Cut style is Dragon Magazine 373):

Furious Smash (warlord): If your ally hits with the attack this exploit provides, the target takes ongoing damage equal to your Wisdom modifier (save ends).

Disciple of Torment (Book of Vile Darkness pages 1-31):

Benefit: Enemies grant combat advantage while subject to effects caused by you that a save can end.

  • \$\begingroup\$ What books/DDI articles are these from? \$\endgroup\$ May 29, 2015 at 22:29
  • \$\begingroup\$ Disciple of torment is The Book of Vile Darkness pages 1-31. Cruel Cut style is Dragon Magazine 373, page 17. Furious smash is Player's Handbook, page 145. \$\endgroup\$
    – Nin
    May 29, 2015 at 22:42

2 Answers 2



You are the source of the ongoing damage from Cruel Cut Style/Furious Smash.

While your ally is making the attack, you are the one causing the effect of the ongoing damage and thus would be able to use the Disciple of Torment feature to cause them to grant combat advantage.

It's important that the Cruel Cut style is not directly modifying the attack (it doesn't say "the attack does X"), it seems clear that you are the one applying the ongoing damage and thus Disciple of Torment applies.



I wouldn't be particularly upset if I was in a game and my GM made the ruling in wax eagle's answer. It's certainly a valid viewpoint.

However, looking at the actual abilities involved, it seems pretty clear that the ongoing damage is due to the attack made by your ally, not the shield bash you make in furious smash. In other words, it's your ally who made a Cruel Cut, all you did was enable it.

Therefore, I would not consider the ongoing damage to be an effect caused by you, and would not grant the benefit from disciple of torment if you were in my game.

I don't think this is a case where the rules-as-written are super clear-cut, so if I were you I would just ask my DM and see how he wants to rule it. Either way is reasonable.

Note: The phrasing "If your ally hits with the attack... [stuff happens]" implies to me that it is the attack making stuff happen, so I would say that Cruel Cut is modifying the attack, which is probably a big part of why I disagree with wax eagle.


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