Can Spiritjaws be used to grapple a manifested ghost or an incorporeal creature?

On the one hand incorporeal subtype says that incorporeal creatures can't be grappled. On the other hand force effects generally ignore incorporeality. So which one overrides the other?

I tend to think (but I'm still in doubt) that incorporeal creatures can't be grappled no matter what. But even if it is true, what about manifested ghost? Manifestation description says that manifested ghost "remains partially on the Ethereal Plane, where is it not incorporeal". So should Spiritjaws be able to grapple it's ethereal part?

RC based answers are OK, but try to provide core answer also, please. I am generally skeptical about RC.


1 Answer 1


After Reading the Forum Post from GitP

I would allow Spirit Jaws to grapple the Ghost due to their connection of the Ethereal Plane and what Force Effects have on the Ethereal Plane. And as a DM, I would make sure that my ghosts have as many ranks in Escape Artist as possible since their Strength will suck, and so will their BAB.

Despite Incorporeal creatures not being able to be tripped or grappled - Ghosts are not Incorporeal on the Ethereal Plane. They are merely Incorporeal on the Material Plane when they manifest, but are still anchored in the Ethereal. Force Effects do effect ethereal creatures, and despite being incorporeal on the Material Plane, they are still Ethereal.

  • \$\begingroup\$ As spiritjaws is a force effect – not an incorporeal creature – I’m not seeing how the quote tells us why this doesn’t work. \$\endgroup\$
    – KRyan
    Sep 14, 2015 at 2:43
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    \$\begingroup\$ Manifested ghosts are different from incorporeal creatures though. Addressing that would improve the answer. \$\endgroup\$ Sep 14, 2015 at 2:57
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    \$\begingroup\$ @KRyan So a Ghost Touch Trip Weapon can trip a ghost? \$\endgroup\$
    – Ruut
    Sep 14, 2015 at 2:58
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    \$\begingroup\$ @Ruut -- that's a bloody good mainsite question if you ask me -- brings to mind images of a ghostly Mr. Wilson having to deal with Ghost Touch Banana Peels being scattered all over :P \$\endgroup\$
    – Shalvenay
    Sep 14, 2015 at 4:05
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    \$\begingroup\$ @annoyingimp There are at least twenty ways to rewrite the sentence I quoted so we'd not be having this discussion. It's nice of the developers to encourage communication between fans. :-) \$\endgroup\$ Sep 15, 2015 at 14:05

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