So, we have been playing Ars Magica 4th ed for a few months and we have a setup where our covenant is lacking silver as a driving storyline aspect. It has been great but then we all sat down and realize that with the amount of terram vis we had, we could literally just conjure gold to take care of all of our debts. We decided to not allow that on the idea of perhaps that would count against the making a "permanent magic item". In any case, we need a system for maintaining and upgrading our covenant. The base rules are alright, but they don't have enough flexibility (unless we are looking at it completely wrong).

We would like to see something for gaining silver, spending silver, how to find out how much magical books are actually worth, etc. I suppose in short maybe some kind of general treasure system?

  • \$\begingroup\$ I seem to remember a book called Covenants. Did you look at that one already? \$\endgroup\$ – Wesley Obenshain Jun 1 '16 at 21:26
  • \$\begingroup\$ Seems that one is 5th Edition. After looking at the book from Atlas Game's website (atlas-games.com/product_tables/AG0280.php). Unfortunately, i really hate the update they did in 5th (I think it was a huge step back from making original and fun quirky characters) so i haven't moved editions yet. \$\endgroup\$ – Dean Petty Jun 1 '16 at 22:54
  • \$\begingroup\$ I only have a copy of the 5th Ed Core, but from what I remember of 4th Ed, I feel like the core mechanics weren't all that different. Can you highlight the major changes? I can check if the 5th Ed covenant management rules would be compatible. \$\endgroup\$ – Wesley Obenshain Jun 2 '16 at 5:01
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    \$\begingroup\$ The major changes from 4th to 5th was the removal of many of the merits and flaws. Beyond that, i have no idea what the changes were to the covenants. I didn't read that far into it i'm afraid. \$\endgroup\$ – Dean Petty Jun 3 '16 at 16:48

In short - No; there is no 4th edition Covenant management system or special rulebook - only what is supplied in the core rules. For the list of official titles take a look here: http://www.redcap.org/page/List_of_products_by_edition#Fourth_Edition_Products

I think* the 4e Wizard's Grimoire has some rules for book management, but cannot recall it having expense and build management. 4e Ordo Nobilis has some very general cost and expenses in it, but not to the detail often asked for.

Longer answer - The Covenants book for 5th and 2nd edition have similar rules, and the 5th edition of Covenants should be very easy to use with 4th edition. It contains a fairly complex system for lab quality, expense management, balancing traits and story hooks for 5th, and several other mechanics which 5th edition Ars Magica improved.

None of the sourcebooks have a "treasure system", none really offer a true vis to silver rate exchange, or anything more than an indication of what books are worth (magical books don't have a price in silver at all, mundane books are typically very cheap with a very limited by region/range of topics).

The conversion from 5e to 4e Covenants should be quasi-compatible, but it will take work.


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