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If you're using the scroll of shrink item and then a scroll of permanency, are you considered the caster for the effects of the shrink item/permanency spell? Specifically the clause

Shrink item can be made permanent with a permanency spell, in which case the affected object can be shrunk and expanded an indefinite number of times, but only by the original caster.

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  • \$\begingroup\$ I've tried showing him the rules compendium "This is the activation method for scrolls. A scroll is a spell or collection of spells that has been stored, mostly finished, in written form. All that’s left to do is perform the finishing parts of the spellcasting" but he says that isn't black and white enough. \$\endgroup\$ – Simon Jan 25 '17 at 1:24
  • \$\begingroup\$ I've also tried saying that since there is a scroll of the spell in the DMG and the permanency scroll says "You cast the desired spell and then follow it with the permanency spell" meaning you have to be the original caster for the scroll to work with any other spell. An expensive scroll without a purpose has no home in the DMG. \$\endgroup\$ – Simon Jan 25 '17 at 1:26
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Yes, you cast spells from scrolls, so that makes you the caster of the scroll, despite using the stats of the original scriber of the scroll.

From Scrolls > Determine Effect:

A spell successfully activated from a scroll works exactly like a spell prepared and cast the normal way.

(emphases mine)

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