Timeline for Is there a layer of the Abyss that is controlled by celestials?
Current License: CC BY-SA 3.0
13 events
| when toggle format | what | by | license | comment | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Aug 5, 2021 at 15:53 | comment | added | Kirt | @KRyan Certainly one example does not a pattern make, but it was the only 5e example of which I was aware. | |
| Aug 5, 2021 at 13:35 | comment | added | KRyan | @Kirt There have been numerous instances throughout D&D of both celestials falling and changing to fiends, and celestials falling and remaining (corrupted) celestials. It is likely that these fallen archons’ denial about their falling plays a role here, though I don’t know that we have enough information to infer any kind of pattern. What we can be sure of, however, is that Zariel ceasing to be a celestial does not automatically mean every other fallen celestial always would. | |
| Aug 4, 2021 at 17:35 | comment | added | Kirt | @MatthewNajmon Please see my comment to Dane above. | |
| Aug 4, 2021 at 17:35 | comment | added | Kirt | @ZanLynx Please see my comment to Dane above. | |
| Aug 4, 2021 at 17:33 | comment | added | Kirt | @Dane Baldur's Gate: Descent into Avernus presents the former Celestial Zariel as a fiend. "Once a mighty angel charged with watching the tides of the Blood War, Zariel succumbed to the corrupting influence of the Nine Hells and fell from grace. Asmodeus admired Zariel's passion for war and offered her rulership of Avernus. She accepted his offer and was transformed by Asmodeus into an archdevil." If the characters successfully redeem her, she becomes an angel again. The change in physical form (type) appears at least connected to, if not caused by, the change in alignment, | |
| Apr 10, 2014 at 15:39 | comment | added | Cristol.GdM | @Lord_Gareth Are you thinking about Munkir and Nekir, the two fallen angels on the Gates of Heaven (layer 77)? | |
| Apr 9, 2014 at 22:42 | comment | added | Lord_Gareth | This is not the layer that was spoken of; I'll be providing an answer of my own once I can get back to my sources. | |
| Apr 9, 2014 at 21:34 | comment | added | Matthew Najmon | They're not good-aligned anymore, but they probably still have their [Good] subtypes (at least in more recent versions, those don't change if an individual has an alignment that doesn't match up.), and those subtypes seem more to do with the "celestial" status than the current alignment of the individual. | |
| Apr 9, 2014 at 20:13 | comment | added | Zan Lynx | @Dane: Does a lawful good Drow cease to be a Drow? Although, yes, a devil or a celestial seems like it should be a special case. | |
| Apr 9, 2014 at 19:01 | comment | added | Dane | My previous comment here is clearly answered by @Draupadi. What I was really trying to ask is whether a Chaotic Evil Fallen Archon is still a Celestial. In my mind, "celestial" is pretty much defined as a "Good Outsider" from the outer planes. As such, a Chaotic Evil outsider ceases to be a celestial. But I might have my definition wrong. | |
| Apr 9, 2014 at 18:26 | comment | added | Dakeyras | @Dane That is correct; as Draupadi states, they are Chaotic Evil but in denial about it. | |
| Apr 9, 2014 at 17:18 | comment | added | Dane | So, just to be 100% clear, the Fallen Archons are not actually Good, correct? | |
| Apr 9, 2014 at 16:31 | history | answered | Draupadi | CC BY-SA 3.0 |