You can use wall of stone to create a bridge, and you can use shadow conjuration, greater to emulate wall of stone.

So assume you use shadow conjuration, greater to create a bridge via wall of stone, how does the 60% real aspect work?

  • Is the 60% chance rolled once, or each time you try to cross the bridge?
  • If you know the danger, can you just test with the tip of your shoe before stepping on?

This seems to be a way to build a trap that is more likely to work on adventurers than on low level peasants/commoners. The latter need a 20 on their save to disbelieve and then still have a 60% chance to get across.

Now could a mage create such a bridge on the way to his home, test it (for the 60% chance), if it fails remove and cast again until he has a bridge that supports him but might fail on other people? Or does he have to check each time he steps on it?


2 Answers 2


The bridge isn't 60% "real." It has a 60% chance to work (or not work, as it were) on non-believers. Allow me to explain...

Those who pass their save and become non-believers in the shadow conjuration...

A creature that succeeds on its save sees the shadow conjurations as transparent images superimposed on vague, shadowy forms.

...must make a percentile roll to see if they can use the bridge (after passing the Will save). If they fail their roll (40% chance) the effect created (in this case, a shadow version of wall of stone) does not apply to them for that usage, and they cannot use the bridge. If they pass the roll, they can cross safely.

Shadow Conjuration

... Shadow objects or substances have normal effects except against those who disbelieve them. Against disbelievers, they are 20% likely to work...

Shadow Conjuration, Greater

This spell functions like shadow conjuration, except that it duplicates any sorcerer or wizard conjuration (summoning) or conjuration (creation) spell of 6th level or lower...

...and nondamaging effects are 60% likely to work against nonbelievers.

This roll must be made each time the effect is "applied" (in this case each time a non-believer attempts to use the bridge) because of the non-believer's uncertainty of success, which comes from the fact that they see the shadow for what it is.

Note that anyone can intentionally fail their Will save (thus avoiding the percentile roll) in order to use the bridge safely. On a similar note, objects always pass their Will saves per the spell description, so will always have a 60% chance of passing. However, I might houserule it in such a way that an object will always pass its Will save and will always fall through, in the interest of making sense.

  • 2
    \$\begingroup\$ The fact that objects always make their save and go through make the shadow spells very bad for creating a shelter. The roof will never keep rain out no matter how real it is. \$\endgroup\$
    – Umbranus
    Commented Oct 26, 2016 at 18:15
  • \$\begingroup\$ @Umbranus I edited my answer -- after reviewing what I had written I realized the bit about objects always falling through was incorrect. Per the rules, they pass the Will save automatically, but would still need to make roll for the 60% "success" chance. I have offered the alternative, of the object always succeeding (or in this case, falling through the bridge), as a possible houserule. \$\endgroup\$ Commented Oct 26, 2016 at 21:37
  • \$\begingroup\$ @Umbranus - forget rain - I think this also means a shadow stone wall will not block arrows and spears... \$\endgroup\$
    – G0BLiN
    Commented Oct 27, 2016 at 21:15
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    \$\begingroup\$ @G0BLiN sure. But recently we had an adventure into very cold regions and all we had at night was a shadowed secure shelter. At least from afar nobody could see our fire. But it only held off 20% of the weather and only held in ~20% of the warmth. \$\endgroup\$
    – Umbranus
    Commented Oct 28, 2016 at 6:41

It might be semantics, but you are able to accept a loss on any saving throw. Willfully believing what you've made is real? Done.

Paizo Forums user KBrewer agrees in his Shadow Conjuration Guide/Reference. (See Phantom Steed spell p3 or Zen Flavoring p7)

Regardless, Will saves (if not failed on purpose) are made once, when you first would come into contact with the stone. That roll applies to all interaction with the same spell. The Will saves would be by person though, so your party could cross willfully believing its stone, but anyone coming behind might notice that their foot sinks a little and... roll Will save. Fail? You're fine. Pass? Oh, dear... you just fell into a chasm.

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    \$\begingroup\$ Thanks for pointing out wilfully failing the save. That makes it easier for those who know about the problem. But would someone who succeeded the save check every time for the 60% chance? Or would that be tested once and then stay the same? \$\endgroup\$
    – Umbranus
    Commented Oct 26, 2016 at 13:57
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    \$\begingroup\$ -1: This question accurately describes how saving throws work in regards to illusions, but doesn't mention the 60% chance involved with Shadow Conjuration at all. \$\endgroup\$
    – DuckTapeAl
    Commented Oct 26, 2016 at 15:29
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    \$\begingroup\$ @DuckTapeAl Failing your save removes the need to factor the 60% at all. Just the saving throws portion answers OP's question. \$\endgroup\$ Commented Oct 26, 2016 at 17:14
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    \$\begingroup\$ @Ifusaso Your answer only covers one possible scenario and doesn't answer the question of how the 60% rule is applied. It does not satisfy the requirements needed to answer the question. \$\endgroup\$ Commented Oct 26, 2016 at 17:43
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    \$\begingroup\$ Right, while it was nice for me to know about choosing to fail the save I am still interessted in the 60% chance application. \$\endgroup\$
    – Umbranus
    Commented Oct 26, 2016 at 18:13

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