I see nothing against it in the Vampire: the Masquerade core book. A vampire of the 8th generation and Willpower 6+ could easily lower his Generation by 2 for an hour and learn powers up to 7 dots, lowering Generation again when he needs the power.

Do other books describing Thaumaturgy prohibit this?


2 Answers 2


I'm relying here on what I consider a common-sense tautology: A rule that says that your traits may not be higher than X prevents your character from having traits higher than X. Extending the premise far enough to suppose a Storyteller would let you buy a trait higher than X under the presumption that temporarily raised Trait Maxima would permit it is, I think, generous enough.

As you posit it:

  1. A vampire of the Eighth Generation uses Blood of Potency, garnering enough successes to lower his Generation to Sixth.
  2. Having raised his Trait Maxima to seven dots, that vampire spends (as an example) 30XP [or 36, depending how you reckon "current"] to raise his Auspex to 6.

Now, eventually, the effects of Blood of Potency wear off, lowering the vampire's trait maxima back down to five. It is self-evident that you cannot use dots that you cannot possess, and there is no rule allowing for those dots to somehow go "dormant" until you raise your attribute maxima to a point where you could make them legal again. Therefore, the result would seem to be that your traits are reduced to beneath the new maxima, and the experience points to purchase them lost. ("Sanctity of Merits" doesn't seem to apply here, as Disciplines aren't Merits.)

Alternately, a Storyteller may decide that such dots go dormant, like those of a ghoul who has not been fed with blood for some time (no longer than half a year, then they start to decay). However, given the ease with which Blood of Potency can be invoked, this is an unlikely and probably ineffective workaround.



The corebook itself clearly prevents this trickery.

  1. Learning takes time. As said on page p124 of the V20 rulebook:

    Learning new Traits, however, is a little more difficult. Even a vampire can’t simply pick up a functioning legal knowledge or learn to fight if he doesn’t know even the basics (to say nothing of learning a new Discipline). Thus, learning an entirely new Ability or Discipline requires some tutoring and study, in addition to the required experience-point expenditure. This study can be simple (a night-school course to learn the basics of Computer) or brutally difficult (months or even years of mind-bending rituals, formulas, and blood manipulation to learn the first dot in Thaumaturgy), but it must always be accomplished. Having the Mentor Background helps, but even a mentor can teach only what she herself knows.

    Some more learning time pointers:

  2. Your generation has a max trait rating (see p270 of the V20 core rulebook)

    Max Trait Rating: This indicates the highest permanent Trait rating (excluding Humanity/Path ratings and Willpower ratings) a vampire of the given Generation can have.

    Which leads me to the following conclusions:

    1. I wouldn't allow you to learn higher level discipline powers, because you need continuous study for weeks. Not the nightly hop-in-and-out method you have with Blood of Potency.
    2. Even if I would wave the learning time, your generational limit (which 5 for 8th generation) would wipe the learned dot away.

If you want to play with higher level discipline powers, then I suggest to start playing with characters that can learn them without issues (so 7th generation and beyond). Have you talked with your ST and fellow players about this?

  • \$\begingroup\$ I have talked to them, and they told me that it's OK, but the dot will only be active when I use Path of Blood, which makes me risk to lose Willpower or spend Willpower pool. \$\endgroup\$ Commented Jan 21, 2017 at 15:26

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