Can I use a full attack and natural attacks in the same round?

Question

I'm playing a 7th level monk variant in D&D 3.5e and I'm a werewolf. The variant has a 1 for 1 BAB. (level 1 = BAB+1) If I'm in hybrid form, Can I make my 2 standard attacks followed by 2 claws and a bite?

Answer 1

No. Your claw/claw/bite or your complement of monk-punches is what you get for a full-round attack, not both. You don't become supernaturally fast enough to both punch and claw simultaneously with the same hand just because you have claws now.

Though in hybrid form you're already using your hands as part of your unarmed attacks, you aren't using your bite. The entry for werewolves notes that they may normally use weapons in their hand(s) and then bite as a secondary attack. This means that the bite – and the bite only – is available as an extra attack. This incurrs the normal -5 penalty for secondary attacks, and you don't have the option of using this as part of your BAB-based attack progression – a bite, paired with normal, non-claw attacks is always a secondary weapon.

The SRD cites that are relevant:

• Manufactured Weapons: You can attack with "manufactured weapons" and any secondaries allowed by the creature description (and for the monk, their unarmed attacks count as the same thing as "manufactured weapons" in this context):

  Some creatures combine attacks with natural and manufactured weapons when they make a full attack. When they do so, the manufactured weapon attack is considered the primary attack unless the creature’s description indicates otherwise and any natural weapons the creature also uses are considered secondary natural attacks. These secondary attacks do not interfere with the primary attack as attacking with an off-hand weapon does, but they take the usual -5 penalty (or -2 with the Multiattack feat) for such attacks, even if the natural weapon used is normally the creature’s primary natural weapon.

• Natural Weapons: A high BAB that normally gives you extra attacks doesn't apply to natural weapons.

  Creatures do not receive additional attacks from a high base attack bonus when using natural weapons.

• Werewolf (hybrid form): The entry for werewolves specifically states that mixing other attacks (manufactured weapons, monk unarmed attacks) with its natural attacks allows only the bite to be used as a secondary. This just confirms more specifically the rule cited above in "Manufactured Weapons".

  A werewolf in hybrid form usually dispenses with weapon attacks, though it can wield a weapon and use its bite as a secondary natural attack.

However, just like any monk can, you can use TWF to get a secondary attack with a your off hand. That could include one of your natural attacks not already being used, such as an off-hand claw, if and only if your DM deems claws to qualify as either "unarmed" or "monk weapons". I'd personally say that they don't qualify as unarmed (no monk's training includes how to use claws, unless your dojo taught a special werewolf-style of martial arts), but I would deem claws to be a monk weapon since they're used nearly identically to the Bagh Nahk aka Tiger Claws, which at least the Arms and Equipment Guide includes as a monk weapon.

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Here's another way to look at it that follows the rules, but is much more intuitive: which attack is your primary? If you want to have multiple BAB-progression attacks, then your unarmed strike is your primary. That means that any other attack you make has to follow the rules for secondaries (or some other rule that lets you get in attacks alongside your primary attack). In the case of being a werewolf, the rules for werewolves and natural attacks say that you may only use the bite as a secondary. There is no rule anywhere that allows for a full complement of class-based primary attacks and a full set of primary and secondary natural attacks in the same round.

Answer 2

OK, starwed’s answer is pretty good, but relying on the FAQ is not a good idea since the FAQ authors are frequently wrong, and moreover were never given authority by WotC to actually state rules (i.e. “FAQ is not RAW”).

The answer is yes.

Manufactured Weapons

An unarmed strike is considered a “manufactured weapon” for the purposes of determining how it attacks, i.e. it gets iteratives, and you don't get separate “unarmed strike weapons” the way you would with claws or slams.

From the SRD:

Some monsters employ manufactured weapons when they attack. Creatures that use swords, bows, spears, and the like follow the same rules as characters, including those for additional attacks from a high base attack bonus and two-weapon fighting penalties. This category also includes “found items,” such as rocks and logs, that a creature wields in combat— in essence, any weapon that is not intrinsic to the creature.

Some creatures combine attacks with natural and manufactured weapons when they make a full attack. When they do so, the manufactured weapon attack is considered the primary attack unless the creature’s description indicates otherwise and any natural weapons the creature also uses are considered secondary natural attacks. These secondary attacks do not interfere with the primary attack as attacking with an off-hand weapon does, but they take the usual −5 penalty (or −2 with the Multiattack feat) for such attacks, even if the natural weapon used is normally the creature’s primary natural weapon.

The first paragraph specifies how manufactured weapon attacks behave normally.

The second paragraph handles mixing manufactured and natural weapons. The most important line here is “These secondary attacks do not interfere with the primary attack as attacking with an off-hand weapon does” – the manufactured weapon attack(s) behave normally (note the lack of any rule stating you do not get its iteratives, and indeed creatures like the Marilith can get iteratives and even use Multiweapon Fighting while still using their natural weapons), but count as your “primary attack” for the purposes of your natural weapons.

Natural Weapons

Natural weapons behave differently from manufactured weapons. They never get iteratives, and instead you can use all of your natural weapons once each in a full-attack (barring the Rapidstrike feat or similar).

From the SRD:

Natural weapons are weapons that are physically a part of a creature. A creature making a melee attack with a natural weapon is considered armed and does not provoke attacks of opportunity. Likewise, it threatens any space it can reach. Creatures do not receive additional attacks from a high base attack bonus when using natural weapons. The number of attacks a creature can make with its natural weapons depends on the type of the attack—generally, a creature can make one bite attack, one attack per claw or tentacle, one gore attack, one sting attack, or one slam attack (although Large creatures with arms or arm-like limbs can make a slam attack with each arm). Refer to the individual monster descriptions.

The most relevant line here is “The number of attacks a creature can make with its natural weapons depends on the type of the attack—generally, a creature can make one bite attack, one attack per claw or tentacle, one gore attack, one sting attack, or one slam attack.” This introduces the idea of what I’m going to call “logical limits” on natural weapons: you cannot make natural weapon attacks with body parts you don’t have or have already used.

As a result, when you hold a manufactured weapon in one hand, you cannot use a Claw attack with that hand. If you hold a manufactured weapon (or pair of manufactured weapon) with both hands, you cannot make a Claw attack with either of those hands.

Going back to the Marilith example, we see the same thing: her Full-Attack entry consists of either a series of sword attacks and a tail slap, if she’s armed, or 6 Slams and a Tail Slap, if she’s not. Because she would make those Slams with her arms, and she would have already used those arms if she was swinging swords, she does not get them.

Monks and Unarmed Strikes

Monks have several special features with respect to unarmed strikes, and most relevant of these is the following, from the SRD:

A monk’s attacks may be with either fist interchangeably or even from elbows, knees, and feet. This means that a monk may even make unarmed strikes with her hands full.

This means that a monk need not run afoul of the “logical limit” on natural weapon attacks: she can make her full contingent of iteratives as Unarmed Strikes, and never once use her hands. As a result, the Claw attacks on her hands are still viable.

Unfortunately, to my knowledge, there is no statted out monk in the game who gets Claw attacks, which might show it. Even if there were, that monk may be treating her Unarmed Strikes as punches – in which case they would block her Claw attacks.

Flurry of Blows

The monk’s Flurry of Blows class feature changes her full-attack when she uses it, but it is not a separate action. From the SRD:

When unarmored, a monk may strike with a flurry of blows at the expense of accuracy. When doing so, she may make one extra attack in a round at her highest base attack bonus, but this attack takes a -2 penalty, as does each other attack made that round. [...] A monk must use a full attack action to strike with a flurry of blows.

Because it is still a full-attack, the above all still applies: she may make all of her manufactured weapon attacks (as modified by Flurry of Blows), and then additionally make any natural weapon attacks she has available.

Conclusion

Assuming you mean you have a Werewolf Monk 7, rather than an ECL 7 Werewolf Monk (who would be either Monk 5 or Monk 4 depending on whether she was afflicted or natural), your full-attack entry would be as follows:

Unarmed Strike +7/+7/+2 melee (1d8+Str), two Claws +2 melee (1d4+½Str), and Bite +2 melee (1d6+½Str)

Answer 3

This is covered by the FAQ. The answer is yes (but all natural attacks are considered secondary, with the -5 penalty and only half strength to damage). A monk can also use TWF as part of a flurry. (The section on monks is pretty long!)

Can a monk who has natural weapon attacks (such as a centaur monk) attack unarmed and still use his natural weapons? For example, let’s say he’s a 4th-level monk. Can he use a flurry of blows and attack at +5/+5/+0 unarmed (plus other bonuses) and then at +0/+0 for 2 hooves?

If the creature normally is allowed to make both weapon attacks and natural weapon attacks as part of the same full attack routine, the monk can do the same (making unarmed strikes in place of weapon attacks). Since a centaur can make two hoof attacks in addition to his longsword attack, a centaur monk can make two hoof attacks in addition to his unarmed strike attack (or attacks, depending on his base attack bonus). The monk can’t use his natural weapon attacks as part of a flurry of blows, but he can make natural weapon attacks in addition to his flurry. Such attacks suffer the same –2 penalty as the monk’s flurry attacks in addition to the normal –5 penalty for secondary natural attacks.

An 4th-level centaur monk has a base attack bonus of +7 (+4 from his 4 monstrous humanoid Hit Dice, and +3 from his 8 monk levels). If he performs a flurry of blows, he makes three unarmed strikes, at +5/+5/+0. He can add two hoof attacks at –2/–2 (–5 as secondary weapons, and –2 from the flurry).

There is a follow-up question:

If a creature with multiple natural attacks (such as the standard two claws and a bite array) takes levels of monk, how do flurry of blows and its natural attack progression interact?

If a creature can use one of its natural weapons as a secondary attack in conjunction with manufactured weapon attacks, it can do the same with that natural weapon in conjunction with a flurry of blows. Any penalty assessed on attacks by the flurry of blows would also apply to the natural weapon attack. For example, a typical lizardfolk can attack with a club and its bite as part of a full attack. Normally, a creature would take a –5 penalty on an attack roll made with a secondary weapon, but since the lizardfolk has Multiattack, the penalty on the attack roll is reduced to –2 and adds only half the lizardfolk’s Strength bonus on the damage roll.

If it were a 1st-level monk, it could make a flurry of blows (using unarmed strikes, not claw attacks), then add a bite attack as a secondary attack. Each unarmed strike would have a –2 penalty (from flurry of blows), and the bite attack would have a –4 penalty (–2 from flurry of blows and –2 from being a secondary weapon, reduced from –5 by Multiattack).

The example they chose actually muddies things, because elsewhere in the FAQ they make it clear that a lizardfolk with a one-handed weapon and no shield can use a claw and bite as secondary weapons, in addition to their weapon attack routine. I guess I'll include that bit as well:

What happens when creatures use their natural weapons as secondary attacks along with a manufactured weapon? For example, lizardfolk have two claws that also serve as hands. What happens when they wield a one- handed weapon in one hand and nothing in the other? Do they lose both claw attacks in exchange for their attacks with the weapon?

Wielding a manufactured weapon doesn’t prevent a creature from using all its natural weaponry, provided that the creature is using the full attack action and the additional natural weapons are free.

I would take the ruling in the FAQ (as opposed to the example) to mean that you could attack with both claws and a bite as secondary attacks in a flurry. There's no reason that using the claws should compete with the monk's unarmed strikes, because as per the monk ability:

A monk’s attacks may be with either fist interchangeably or even from elbows, knees, and feet. This means that a monk may even make unarmed strikes with her hands full.

Answer 4

A monk cannot use natural weapons in a flurry because they are not unarmed strikes nor are they monk special weapons, however there is no reason a monk cannot make a full attack without flurry while utalizing all his or her natural weapon attacks as well

Answer 5

The Beast Strike Feat from the Dragonmarks: Way of the Shackled Beast article in Dragon Magazine Issue 355 allows you to add claw or slam damage to Unarmed Strike Attacks as a monk. Its what actually makes Eldritch Claw Warlock and Monk multiclassing work.

Answer 6

You can use natural weapons as part of Flurry of Blows with the Feral Combat Training feat. As the Paizo FAQ states: "Feral Combat Training allows you to use the selected natural attack as if it were a monk weapon". [Source] Though, I'm not sure how the natural weapon (of say 2d6 with INA, which would apply in this case) would scale with the unarmed damage increases. Per the feat, "While using the selected natural weapon, you can apply the ... effects that augment an unarmed strike."